In the last rounds i thought Mandzo should be there as Mate wasn't so i thought we were lacking physical forwards, but now Mate is there we don't need Mandzo. Let him go prove himself first.
I prob agree with you that Srna can't play right back and maybe Corluka can't play centre, but its up to players really. If they feel they can make the switch then try it. But if they are happy where they are keep it the same. It something to talk about. In England i heard that O'Neil say him spoke to Milner about where he wants to play this season and if he thinks he can do central mid. Milner said yes and is a revolution. That idea of Srna right back and Corluka centre would only happen if the players feel confident with it. If they don't then yeah shouldn't do it.
at the present moment in time though Rakitic is a more foreward thinking player than Srna is. Rakitic would give a different dimension to what Srna is dishing out at moment. Maybe drop him for a game see what his response is. i remember Bilic did it once before in favor of Rapaic which brought improved performed from Dario.
Bilic has tried out Cale several times before and ultimately wasn't confident in his performance. Yes, Cale is a defender and Pranjic isn't. So what. I'm not comfortable with Cale at left back. I just dont see him as the solution to the problem at left back. Is he an upgrade? Yes. However, a minor upgrade.
Yes, Cale is an upgrade for defensive purposes and could have locked up a spot at left back if he would have pulled the trigger on that half volley in the box in the first half. What was he trying to do? Make a ridiculous pass to someone covered. Why not go instinct on the play and just blast it on frame?
Why is no one talking about that play. We would all be talking about Cale more seriously if he pulls the trigger and scores. But on the flip side, Cale was part of a 3-5-2 when that happened and had no defensive responsibilities. So he could roam as far forward as he wanted.
Let Lovren get adjusted to real ball in Ligue 1. His experience and knowledge of the game will triple down this stretch run of the French season. Look for him to be ready in September. Corluka is a wall and usually never disappoints errrm red card vs. Belarus. Srna cannot play defense at the international level. End of story. He will always start in the midfield with Modric and Kranjcar.
Eduardo always has a starting spot and I'd like to see more of him with Bilic. If we have the late lead then put Olic in there to run around like a mad man and annoy the defense. Watch out for Kalinic though. By next September he could be all business.
Now there's still the captaincy issue to discuss….OH ME OH MY!!!!!
Denis, Cale is ABSOLUTELY an upgrade from Pranjic at LB. There's a reason why, on any team sheet, full-backs are listed as defenders. It's not a coincidence that Euro 08 qualifying was accomplished with a central defender at LB while we were exposed again and again and again during wc 10 qualifying playing a winger (ie, not a defender) as a LB. Heres some elementary math; LB= defender. Pranjic=not a defender. Cale=defender=LB
I think we all agree here that Pranjic shouldn't be in defense. however, bilic doesn't think so. This only leaves one option, bringing Pranjic off the bench for one of our midfielders. I am open to this idea.
Cale isnt an upgrade for Pranjic at leftback.
Yes, 3-5-2 is crazy.
@Dinamofan
"I think Mandzo is at the stage Rakitic and Kalinic were a year ago. Big egos and thinking they had a right to be in the squad. But since then both Rakitic and Kalinic have had hard managers who have made them work as individuals and made them better players. I actually think Mandzo could do with having the national team door shut to him for a while and then to wait and see what he does abroad."
I cant believe I didnt think of this. You are absolutely right. Mario doesnt go by "super mario" for no reason. He was amazing at one point in his career.
Radman, maybe he hasn't but i'm not ready to boot him out after a win over Belgium. I don't agree that he's learned nothing. He wanted to try something in a friendly so fair enough let him try it. If he hadn't learnt nothing he wouldn't have called Dujmovic, Jelavic and seems Vida, Badelj, Perisic and Kalinic are also in his thinking for the Euro's. He also wouldn't have got rid of Drpic, Vejic and Leko.
The team didn't play all that well, but it was just a friendly. I think when you talk of Niko's shot being sadly lacking in accuracy you're being far far too negative. It went in the back of the net and Niko made the ball move in the air. Pretty hard to be accurate when you're making the ball move in the air – plus it finished in the corner. Seems fair enough strike to me.
Belgium – have Kompany, Vermaelen, Verthoghen… 3 world class defensive players. Can't say the same going forward, but there is something their on that Belgium side. I expected Croatia to win and play better.. but next time maybe it will be better. What changes would you have done as you also advocate players staying in under 21's. i also still don't see what Krizanac, Simunic, Lovren, Corluka and Cale did wrong. Its a fecking clean sheet?
We played 4-5-1 against Germany in the Euros, we looked great doing so. The funny thing about Bilic and his 3-5-2 is that when we played England in Wembley, when we knocked them out, the English played a 3-5-2. After the game Bilic said that he heard that England might try that formation, didn't think they would have the audacity to do so. So why would Bilic try such a formation against any organized side? A 3-5-2 can only work if you are playing Fifa Soccer from EA Sports.
Fear the worst Gentlemen, fear the worst!!!!!! I do not think that Bilic has learned anything from his many mistakes.
I wouldn't play 4-5-1 as we have enough decent strikers to play two up top.
To me i believe there is enough to work with. Bilic is on the right type of lines with his squad. Just needs Klasnic for Mandzo. He can't keep playing Mandzo as he's still unproven outside HNL1. Also if you've already got hardworkers like Bilic and Olic, what you now need is killer goalscorers which is not at all how i'd describe Mandzo. Even in HNL1 he only averages 15. Klasnic is the guy when you need the goal. But i guess at least now Bilic is not always gonna cry about Eduardo being hurt like in the past. He is actually getting other strikers in there which is good.
I think Mandzo is at the stage Rakitic and Kalinic were a year ago. Big egos and thinking they had a right to be in the squad. But since then both Rakitic and Kalinic have had hard managers who have made them work as individuals and made them better players. I actually think Mandzo could do with having the national team door shut to him for a while and then to wait and see what he does abroad.
People are saying Pranjic for Cale if BILIC is going to keep with this formation. At the end of the day i've already said that 4-4-2 is better, but if Bilic is going to play 3-5-2 then he may as well put Pranjic there rather than Cale. Cale is a defender, Pranjic a midfielder. Cale yesterday actually reminded me of when we used to play Boris Zivkovic at left wing back if anyone can remember that far back.
But it needs to be 4-4-2. Kranjcar wide left, Srna or Raki wide right and get back to what there familiar with. Pranjic won't moan at being benched and Cale or Simunic can do left back. Thats a formation that worked well for us in past.
But yeah Radman its not us lot saying 3-5-2, but that's the formation Bilic was playing yesterday..
Re: Alex
With the Juric and Vuko comment i was referring to what was said by Fistonic in the video rather than yourself.
You read my mind man. I could even go further and play with 5 midfielders (including Rakitic there) and only one attacker.
@ Petar
I agree. I would make Pranjic play as a CM or maybe a LM but that's it. He should play as a LB only if We are in an extraordinary need of goals against teams like Malta or Kazakhstan.
Have you people learned anything? Pranjic for Cale? We need a defender that can defend. Who cares if he is shaky going forward, he is there to defend. Where has Pranjic got us thus far?
3-5-2 is a TERRIBLE formation. No team in the world can play that and make it work. Not Barca, Not Brasil, DEFINITELY not Croatia. 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 and Pranjic should never play LB again in his life.
"Why did Bilic wait to the last 10 to put on Dujmovic?"
I agree. Maybe Slaven Bilic is giving Vuki a look since the Ukrainian league already started. As I meantioned in the video wrap up, I haven't been big on Vukojevic since he joined the national team. I always thought, "a great prospect, he's young, he has time to blossom into a N. Kovac." Maybe all the high expectations cursed him in the end.
Great point on Rakitic
@dinamofan
"On Cale. I thought he did very well defensively, but going forward he wasn't sure what to do. When Pranjic came on he looked better. "
I agree on Cale, he was lost on offense. Pranjic deserves the start over Hrvoje.
Vukojevic was a mess all game. The ridiculous yellow card, a few more mistimed tackles, and lazy passes. Instead of getting better as the years go by, Vuki has gotten worse.
@Ivo Miljanovic
I like your lineup with Rakitic coming off the bench. Pletikosa is out of the equation until he plays at least 3 months in goal for at least a mediocre club in a mediocre league.
Dinamofan- Agreed. Vukojevic needs to "hunt in packs". Like I said, it's not his personality to play as a primary holder- that position needs more of an alpha personality (that's why I loved Dujmovic' crunching challenge late in the match- he was establishing himself). While Dujmovic doesn't have the personality of N.Kovac, he's more assertive and far more comfortable as the lone holder than Vukojevic. I never thought Juric was better than Vukojevic- in fact, they share the similiar quality of being most effective when used in tandem. I even recall Juric saying exactly that after the Ukraine match.
Re: Alex The worst thing about 3-5-2 is really that Kranjcar and Modric are on top of each. They are both far too close. They need to spread out a bit and that's why 4-4-2 is best. As i say i feel Modric can handle himself in the centre. Kranjcar is definitely happiest at left mid – self confessed – watch his pompey interviews on you tube..
Pranjic will accept being on bench, but is a great man to come in. Rakitic can play right, depends really where Srna and Corluka feel happiest. Its something for Bilic to talk to them both about. Cale just is not happy on left wing. i've barely seen this guy score a goal or assist much at Trabzonspor. He's a solid little defender and is a possible solution to left back. But is no wing back.
I disagree about people saying juric is better than Vukojevic. Juric played exactly same as this when he was in side. The only reason i think Dujmovic is better is that he is tall and a stronger physical specimen then the other two. That helps defence in crosses and he also imposes himself. He also plays that position club level. I remember Ogjen at dinamo and this isn't his usual game at all. He will hunt in packs, but he's being made out to be worse than he is by playing this one man defensive mid role.
You are right this reminded me of Zlatko Kranjcars 3-5-2 formation too – though Cale was no Marko Babic. Babic and Srna use to fly down those wings. ZK formation broke down through Tudor in mid.
Next game i'd like to see Dujmovic tried out and Klasnic to come back in. Bilic worked very hard and so did Olic, but we need that killer touch in the box. Someone whose not afraid to shoot.
I'll agree with you Dinamofan about 3-5-2- it's funny, for a system that's intended to put an emphasis on midfield creativity, it was sorely lacking. It also was noticeable that there was too much space- at least in the 1st half- in front of the backline, something that shouldn't be happening in that system. In fact, with the exception of the DM gaps, the 1st half reminded me of Croatia circa 2006- Stifled creativity and a (over)reliance on wingbacks. This is one of the main reasons why few sides play 3-5-2 anymore. While it can (possibly) work against 4-4-2, it's ridiculously vulnerable to most variations of 4-5-1. It also becomes too easy for a quality opponent to push the wingbacks back forcing the side to play a 5-3-2 instead of a 3-5-2. While it's not the only reason, this performance demonstrates that 3-5-2 is a poor choice of formation (or at least as a primary formation). With few exceptions, we didn't test their keeper- they looked like they had us under control for most of the match. I've no problems with experimenting (I think it's good), but I just hope that Bilic sees that the same inherant weaknesses with 3-5-2( that caused Bilic to abandon it in 06) are still there.
The annoying thing though was that Kranjcar only got to go out wide for 10 mins when Krizanac got injured and we reshuffled and he scored, then Bilic took off modric for pranjic and Niko was back in centre. He needs to keep him out wide where he as space and he was showing incredible footwork just to keep possession in the centre. Left mid is Niko's best position, that's where i think he should play. Modric can cope in the centre. He'll be fine there. Rakitic is happy on the right. I actually think Bilic has the right combinations in his squad. Up front he has the hardworkers in Olic, Kalinic, Mandzo and Bilic, he has the finishers in Eduardo, Budan and Klasnic and he just needs to put it all together. I can think of plenty of coaches who have less to work with than Slaven Bilic. Dick Advocaat for one 🙂
I'm quite positive about things despite that i hoped for better style of play. There seems enough of a squad there to do good things.
All in all, I thought it was a really interesting game, it will give Bilic a lot to think about in preparation for the euro qualifiers.
Belgium played well by pressing the ball and stifling our midfield creativity, making it very difficult for us to create chances. Vukojevic was disappointing in DMF, a role that is so crucial for us with Modric in the centre. I wish Bilic had given Dujmovic more time on the pitch to see if he'd do any better. This is really so important for us to get right.
Cale seemed keen and played reasonably well, still has a lot to learn. Mandzukic was wasteful. Modric was having an off day, should really have put that chance away, on target at least!
Very happy with Kranjcar, his work rate has improved 10-fold and of course the goal. Runje does make me jumpy but didn't do anything wrong and put in some crucial saves.
My MOTM is without a doubt Corluka, who was as solid as a rock and put in some match-saving tackles.
Re: Ivo I have no problem with that line up whatsoever. i'm not sure this 3-5-2 works. If he already had Cale at left i didn't see the need for him to go wing backs. Fair enough if Pranjic was there – then play wing backs, but Cale is an out and out defender so he may as well play 4-4-2. Not exactly sure what Bilic was doing today with his system. Someone needs to take Srna aside and ask him where he wants to play cos he seems to be going more and more defensive these days.
I'd play
Pletikosa – Srna, Corluka, Lovren or Krizanac, Simunic or Cale – Rakitic, Dujmovic, Modric, Kranjcar – Olic or Klasnic, Eduardo
Subs: M Bilic, Vukojevic, Pranjic, Knezevic, Petric, Badelj, Perisic, Runje
Its fun how a win can paper over the cracks.. i think we were better defensively with rakitic, srna, kranjcar all working back. Mate Bilic and Olic working hard as well. We seemed to lack flow to our creative game and i think this had something to do with the formation whilst helping the defence messed up the midfield. Its obvious 4-4-2 is the best formation for the side going forward. Kranjcar finally got wide and scored a great goal. But he spent most of the game being stifled. Modric – reasonable, but not his best game.
On Cale. I thought he did very well defensively, but going forward he wasn't sure what to do. When Pranjic came on he looked better. If we are going to keep up this 3-5-2 its got to be Pranjic left wing back. Cale has shown he is reliable cover as a Lovren.
I thought the one player who had an excellant above average game was Corluka. Simunic did well too. Vukojevic had a bad first half, bit better second half, but was making bad passes as well.
Eduardo showed some nice stuff when he came on. 10 mins of Eduardo was more watchable than the 70 of Olic and Bilic. I think Klasnic has a place in this squad as well. Can't leave him out.
Why did Bilic wait to the last 10 to put on Dujmovic? I know that he's on season break but he could surely play for 30 minutes (btw I loved that one crunching challenge he put in…). Vukojevic simply doesn't have the personality that's needed in his position. Looking at others views of him on CSR, I'm clearly not the only one who thinks so. I must say that the best thing to happen to Ivan Rakitic is Felix Magath- Ivan has become a MUCH different player recently. He (now) tackles, tracks back, and exudes a confidence (as opposed to a youthful arrogance) that he previously lacked.
Approaching Hlf time, I'll say just 3 things (btw I missed first 9 minutes). Vukojevic has been lousy. There's too much space in front of the back line and Belgium have been dominating in that area. Hope to see Dujmovic replace him. Second, Bilic has put in a good shift- he's won more fouls than anyone(and he didn't have a chance on that cutback from Srna as their defender was sliding in as the ball reached him). Still, I'm not sure about him and Olic as a pair- I'd like to see Bilic-Eduardo. Third, Cale looks decent- way more comfortable than v Andorra. He's getting forward AND defending. Hopefully this continue.
with regards to the Hajduk game on the weekend. Strinic, Tomasov, Maloca and Sharbini all had excellent games. I don't know what that ceiling is for Maloca, he is steady, but don't know what the futute holds for him.
Strinic looked very good charging up and down from LB. I think he should be given another shot to earn at least one cap. Considering that nobody else has decided to take that job for themselves.
Sharbini and Tomasov looked pretty damn good. Marin Tomasov, from the last 5 games before the break, through the break and that opening game is looking better and better. He whips in a nice cross, has a very good shot from long range and is effective from dead ball situations. I would actually call for him to get a call up if he continues to play like he has been playing. Slaven Bilic was close to giving this kid a call when he was only 20 playing for Zadar. It took him awhile to steady himself at Hajduk, but hes looking pretty nice now.
Anas sharbini is also finally starting to find his feet. He had some great passes on the day. The pass to assist Cernat was reminiscent of something Xavi would do.
Nope, Maloca played on the weekend. Believe me, Maloca is very much first team. I watched the Hajduk game, they lined up Subasic – Rubil, Maloca, Buljat, Strinic – Skoko, Andric – Tomasov, Ibricic, Shrabini – Vukusic. Maloca always starts at CB.
I believe that Kramaric is definitely of the quality to be in the Under 21 team in some capacity. However, if he wont be starting, I don't want him on the bench. I think its critical for his development that he play as many competitive games as possible. Also, I dont think anyone can dispute this, his skill set is awfully similar to that of Kalinic. Kalinic is just much more physically stronger, knows how to hold the line and opposing defenses on his back in a 4-5-1. Personally, I do not like to similar strikers together. Thats just my opinion though. I am always in favor of lining up with 2 strikers, but, as I have also said, the strength of this team is the midfield. I believe that Ladic also recognizes that and has opted for ball possession tactic.
As for Tepuric, I have seen a few Slaven Belupo games, he has intrigued me. I do believe that Kramaric is a better forward. It all comes down to getting Kramaric the most minutes, for me anyways. In my view, if he cant start, then he has to play somewhere for a full 90 mins. The reasons I dont think he could start are as stated, in my view he and Kalinic are are bit of the same and we are playing to our strength which is the midfield area.
Jajalo and Badelj were also deployed in a holding role once again yesterday.
I still hope that Lovren and Vida will play the remaining three games. Lovren better see significant action in todays game.
I can't see how there is no room for Kramaric. Also where is Duje Cop or Smrekar. How did Ladic draw the conclusion that Tepuric deserved a call up. i've already named about 8 players who could be ahead of him..
Maloca always starts for Hajduk when healthy and he isn't suspended.
Those other guys you mentioned, while they don't start for their club teams, don't expect them to start for the Under 21s. A seat on the bench is the right spot. As for Kramaric, I don't know if it is valuable for him. I think he should be playing as much as he can. Also, at 19, he has 2 cycles left with the Under 21s, plenty of time for young Kramaric. I think its the same as what Spain did with Bojan Krkic. The kid played as many games for all selections. He was literally bouncing up and down from the 17, 19 and 21s. Month after month, getting in as many games and helping all those teams. If Kalinic will be starting the games, I would rather Kramaric play a full 90 mins with the Under 19s then to have only 20 mins with the under 21s. The Under 19s will be entering phase 2 of their qualification this spring. He can definitely help them out there. He still has 2 campaigns ahead of him with the Under 21s as a prelude to a National Team call up. Kramaric and Vukusic would be a nice tandem for the Under 19s.
Got the squad in front of me now – Maloca does not always start for Hajduk. Vrsaljko – first game for Dinamo at weekend, Ozobic definitely does not start for Spartak Moscow and Tepuric also not a regular starter
Don't know where is – Jugovic, Knezevic, Milicevic, Kramaric, Vuckevic, Delic.. Those are the guys that play regular not Ozobic and Tepuric
Yeah it was Pamic wasn't it. Ademi is one of those round headed flat haired players as well so got him mixed up – with Jajalo and Badelj also coming from that type of hairstyle its not helping me seperate them from distance 🙂
Zvonko Pamic – i mean what are Rijeka doing there. The guy's on loan with Karlovac for what reason.
There was definitely space for Kramaric. This is another sign of Ladic's confusing selections. He selected FRANCIS TEPURIC – strange. Tepuric can't get in Belupo's team and done nothing so far. Kramaric is on the fringes of the Dinamo line up. Dodo prob played as we were playing rubbish Sesvete, but Kramaric could easily be a starter. He has to be playing for Croatia under 21's.
On Sertic – i don't actually believe he's had much of a season so far so first thing he needs to think about is getting regular club football. Same with Gavranovic if you're not playing then no point in thinking about international football at the moment.
I don't want the guy anyway. Unless you state from the beginning who your country is, then to hell with you. I don't want guys playing games and using two countries to wrestle against one another to get a guy a shot at the national team sooner. Anas and Ahmad Sharbini had other invitations as well, both stated that their dream is to play for Croatia. Sertic doesn't have the balls to say what he truly wants. He is basically plotting with his agent, trying to find a team where he has a realistic shot at playing regularly.
He should not play for Croatia under any circumstance. The kid can't read, write or speak croatian. That is reason enough not to include him. Plus, he is not croatian, he is french. His grandfather might have been a croat, but big deal.
I read that basically Sertic has long forgotten his roots and doesn't care to play for Hrvatska since he's 2nd generation French-or something like that.
That wasn't Ademi, he played the same day with the Under 19s. Zvonko Pamic took the free kick, his first under 21 cap by the way.
With Kalinic in the Under 21 program, not enough room for Kramaric, sad to say. Ladic seems to prefer a 4-5-1. The strength of this team is the midfield. Kalinic and Kramaric together could work, but, both strikers are a bit too similar in skill sets. If Kramaric was blazing fast, i could see it, but he is about the same speed as Nikola. Also, the fact that he doesnt start for his club team also works against him. These guys all start for their respective clubs. Ladic has emphasized how valuable starting for your club is to playing for the Under21s and success at that level on a personal level as well for the club. That being said, Kramaric should not be sitting on the bench. Starting for the under 19s is probably best. He still has plenty of time ahead with the Under21s.
I hope Lovren will be allowed to play the final 3 games for the Under 21s.
Vida's injured – Lovren is in the A side. I didn't catch the game, but that goal from Perisic was nice. I think Perisic will be a star in the A side. I think if you got Rakitic for the right and Pranjic for the left as cover – maybe we don't need Gabric. I think Perisic may provide more goals from midfield which is a problem. Rakitic scores, but Kranjcar and Modric don't quite score enough so perhaps Bilic needs to look at a goalscoring midfielder on his bench like Perisic rather than Gabric. I'm sure opportunities will still come for Badelj, Ilicevic and Gabric when people are injured, but i'd go with Perisic when the qualifiers start.
I don't mind this defeat much. The side isn't totally solid. The left is a bit iffy, Barbaric and Maloca aren't so great and if i'm right is that Ademi on that free kick.. these are only first matches for some of these players. Where was Kramaric?
That was a clear penalty. The First french goal was pure Class. You cant really blame anyone on that, it was executed to perfection. With no Vida and Lovren we were always going to have an uphill battle. There were still some positives to take away from that match for Ladic.
Clear Missed Penalty call….On a side note why don't you guys do a piece about up and coming croatian soccer prospects for the national team? Who are the new up and coming faces to look out for, for the national team? Any stars on the horizon? What is going on with gregory sertic? Is he going to play for us?
That's a clear cut penalty in my book. I don't even know why there was an issue with no call. I guess it's a friendly for refs too. No big deal, just a scrimmage.
Thanks again for the vid Zach. You're always on top of things around here!
During the first half the match was pretty even (ended 1-1). I could even say that the referee didn't call a penalty over Kalinic by the end of that half. The second half, with a lot of subs in, was french without a doubt. There's a big quality difference between the starters and the subs in the U21 national team. Definitely, Rakitic, Lovren and Vida have to be part of that team.
In the last rounds i thought Mandzo should be there as Mate wasn't so i thought we were lacking physical forwards, but now Mate is there we don't need Mandzo. Let him go prove himself first.
I prob agree with you that Srna can't play right back and maybe Corluka can't play centre, but its up to players really. If they feel they can make the switch then try it. But if they are happy where they are keep it the same. It something to talk about. In England i heard that O'Neil say him spoke to Milner about where he wants to play this season and if he thinks he can do central mid. Milner said yes and is a revolution. That idea of Srna right back and Corluka centre would only happen if the players feel confident with it. If they don't then yeah shouldn't do it.
at the present moment in time though Rakitic is a more foreward thinking player than Srna is. Rakitic would give a different dimension to what Srna is dishing out at moment. Maybe drop him for a game see what his response is. i remember Bilic did it once before in favor of Rapaic which brought improved performed from Dario.
@Alex
Bilic has tried out Cale several times before and ultimately wasn't confident in his performance. Yes, Cale is a defender and Pranjic isn't. So what. I'm not comfortable with Cale at left back. I just dont see him as the solution to the problem at left back. Is he an upgrade? Yes. However, a minor upgrade.
Yes, Cale is an upgrade for defensive purposes and could have locked up a spot at left back if he would have pulled the trigger on that half volley in the box in the first half. What was he trying to do? Make a ridiculous pass to someone covered. Why not go instinct on the play and just blast it on frame?
Why is no one talking about that play. We would all be talking about Cale more seriously if he pulls the trigger and scores. But on the flip side, Cale was part of a 3-5-2 when that happened and had no defensive responsibilities. So he could roam as far forward as he wanted.
Let Lovren get adjusted to real ball in Ligue 1. His experience and knowledge of the game will triple down this stretch run of the French season. Look for him to be ready in September. Corluka is a wall and usually never disappoints errrm red card vs. Belarus. Srna cannot play defense at the international level. End of story. He will always start in the midfield with Modric and Kranjcar.
Eduardo always has a starting spot and I'd like to see more of him with Bilic. If we have the late lead then put Olic in there to run around like a mad man and annoy the defense. Watch out for Kalinic though. By next September he could be all business.
Now there's still the captaincy issue to discuss….OH ME OH MY!!!!!
Denis,
Cale is ABSOLUTELY an upgrade from Pranjic at LB. There's a reason why, on any team sheet, full-backs are listed as defenders. It's not a coincidence that Euro 08 qualifying was accomplished with a central defender at LB while we were exposed again and again and again during wc 10 qualifying playing a winger (ie, not a defender) as a LB.
Heres some elementary math; LB= defender. Pranjic=not a defender. Cale=defender=LB
@Petar Radman,
I think we all agree here that Pranjic shouldn't be in defense. however, bilic doesn't think so. This only leaves one option, bringing Pranjic off the bench for one of our midfielders. I am open to this idea.
Cale isnt an upgrade for Pranjic at leftback.
Yes, 3-5-2 is crazy.
@Dinamofan
"I think Mandzo is at the stage Rakitic and Kalinic were a year ago. Big egos and thinking they had a right to be in the squad. But since then both Rakitic and Kalinic have had hard managers who have made them work as individuals and made them better players. I actually think Mandzo could do with having the national team door shut to him for a while and then to wait and see what he does abroad."
I cant believe I didnt think of this. You are absolutely right. Mario doesnt go by "super mario" for no reason. He was amazing at one point in his career.
Radman, maybe he hasn't but i'm not ready to boot him out after a win over Belgium. I don't agree that he's learned nothing. He wanted to try something in a friendly so fair enough let him try it. If he hadn't learnt nothing he wouldn't have called Dujmovic, Jelavic and seems Vida, Badelj, Perisic and Kalinic are also in his thinking for the Euro's. He also wouldn't have got rid of Drpic, Vejic and Leko.
The team didn't play all that well, but it was just a friendly. I think when you talk of Niko's shot being sadly lacking in accuracy you're being far far too negative. It went in the back of the net and Niko made the ball move in the air. Pretty hard to be accurate when you're making the ball move in the air – plus it finished in the corner. Seems fair enough strike to me.
Belgium – have Kompany, Vermaelen, Verthoghen… 3 world class defensive players. Can't say the same going forward, but there is something their on that Belgium side. I expected Croatia to win and play better.. but next time maybe it will be better. What changes would you have done as you also advocate players staying in under 21's. i also still don't see what Krizanac, Simunic, Lovren, Corluka and Cale did wrong. Its a fecking clean sheet?
We played 4-5-1 against Germany in the Euros, we looked great doing so. The funny thing about Bilic and his 3-5-2 is that when we played England in Wembley, when we knocked them out, the English played a 3-5-2. After the game Bilic said that he heard that England might try that formation, didn't think they would have the audacity to do so. So why would Bilic try such a formation against any organized side? A 3-5-2 can only work if you are playing Fifa Soccer from EA Sports.
Fear the worst Gentlemen, fear the worst!!!!!! I do not think that Bilic has learned anything from his many mistakes.
I wouldn't play 4-5-1 as we have enough decent strikers to play two up top.
To me i believe there is enough to work with. Bilic is on the right type of lines with his squad. Just needs Klasnic for Mandzo. He can't keep playing Mandzo as he's still unproven outside HNL1. Also if you've already got hardworkers like Bilic and Olic, what you now need is killer goalscorers which is not at all how i'd describe Mandzo. Even in HNL1 he only averages 15. Klasnic is the guy when you need the goal. But i guess at least now Bilic is not always gonna cry about Eduardo being hurt like in the past. He is actually getting other strikers in there which is good.
I think Mandzo is at the stage Rakitic and Kalinic were a year ago. Big egos and thinking they had a right to be in the squad. But since then both Rakitic and Kalinic have had hard managers who have made them work as individuals and made them better players. I actually think Mandzo could do with having the national team door shut to him for a while and then to wait and see what he does abroad.
Re: Radman
People are saying Pranjic for Cale if BILIC is going to keep with this formation. At the end of the day i've already said that 4-4-2 is better, but if Bilic is going to play 3-5-2 then he may as well put Pranjic there rather than Cale. Cale is a defender, Pranjic a midfielder. Cale yesterday actually reminded me of when we used to play Boris Zivkovic at left wing back if anyone can remember that far back.
But it needs to be 4-4-2. Kranjcar wide left, Srna or Raki wide right and get back to what there familiar with. Pranjic won't moan at being benched and Cale or Simunic can do left back. Thats a formation that worked well for us in past.
But yeah Radman its not us lot saying 3-5-2, but that's the formation Bilic was playing yesterday..
Re: Alex
With the Juric and Vuko comment i was referring to what was said by Fistonic in the video rather than yourself.
@ Dfan
My line up is for a 4-4-2, never a 3-5-2.
@ Denis
You read my mind man. I could even go further and play with 5 midfielders (including Rakitic there) and only one attacker.
@ Petar
I agree. I would make Pranjic play as a CM or maybe a LM but that's it. He should play as a LB only if We are in an extraordinary need of goals against teams like Malta or Kazakhstan.
Have you people learned anything? Pranjic for Cale? We need a defender that can defend. Who cares if he is shaky going forward, he is there to defend. Where has Pranjic got us thus far?
3-5-2 is a TERRIBLE formation. No team in the world can play that and make it work. Not Barca, Not Brasil, DEFINITELY not Croatia. 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 and Pranjic should never play LB again in his life.
@Alex
"Why did Bilic wait to the last 10 to put on Dujmovic?"
I agree. Maybe Slaven Bilic is giving Vuki a look since the Ukrainian league already started. As I meantioned in the video wrap up, I haven't been big on Vukojevic since he joined the national team. I always thought, "a great prospect, he's young, he has time to blossom into a N. Kovac." Maybe all the high expectations cursed him in the end.
Great point on Rakitic
@dinamofan
"On Cale. I thought he did very well defensively, but going forward he wasn't sure what to do. When Pranjic came on he looked better. "
I agree on Cale, he was lost on offense. Pranjic deserves the start over Hrvoje.
Vukojevic was a mess all game. The ridiculous yellow card, a few more mistimed tackles, and lazy passes.
Instead of getting better as the years go by, Vuki has gotten worse.
@Ivo Miljanovic
I like your lineup with Rakitic coming off the bench. Pletikosa is out of the equation until he plays at least 3 months in goal for at least a mediocre club in a mediocre league.
And I also agree that Bilic-Olic is redundant. Bilic-Eduardo or Bilic-Klasnic makes more sense.
Dinamofan- Agreed. Vukojevic needs to "hunt in packs". Like I said, it's not his personality to play as a primary holder- that position needs more of an alpha personality (that's why I loved Dujmovic' crunching challenge late in the match- he was establishing himself). While Dujmovic doesn't have the personality of N.Kovac, he's more assertive and far more comfortable as the lone holder than Vukojevic.
I never thought Juric was better than Vukojevic- in fact, they share the similiar quality of being most effective when used in tandem. I even recall Juric saying exactly that after the Ukraine match.
Re: Alex
The worst thing about 3-5-2 is really that Kranjcar and Modric are on top of each. They are both far too close. They need to spread out a bit and that's why 4-4-2 is best. As i say i feel Modric can handle himself in the centre. Kranjcar is definitely happiest at left mid – self confessed – watch his pompey interviews on you tube..
Pranjic will accept being on bench, but is a great man to come in. Rakitic can play right, depends really where Srna and Corluka feel happiest. Its something for Bilic to talk to them both about. Cale just is not happy on left wing. i've barely seen this guy score a goal or assist much at Trabzonspor. He's a solid little defender and is a possible solution to left back. But is no wing back.
I disagree about people saying juric is better than Vukojevic. Juric played exactly same as this when he was in side. The only reason i think Dujmovic is better is that he is tall and a stronger physical specimen then the other two. That helps defence in crosses and he also imposes himself. He also plays that position club level. I remember Ogjen at dinamo and this isn't his usual game at all. He will hunt in packs, but he's being made out to be worse than he is by playing this one man defensive mid role.
You are right this reminded me of Zlatko Kranjcars 3-5-2 formation too – though Cale was no Marko Babic. Babic and Srna use to fly down those wings. ZK formation broke down through Tudor in mid.
Next game i'd like to see Dujmovic tried out and Klasnic to come back in. Bilic worked very hard and so did Olic, but we need that killer touch in the box. Someone whose not afraid to shoot.
I'll agree with you Dinamofan about 3-5-2- it's funny, for a system that's intended to put an emphasis on midfield creativity, it was sorely lacking. It also was noticeable that there was too much space- at least in the 1st half- in front of the backline, something that shouldn't be happening in that system. In fact, with the exception of the DM gaps, the 1st half reminded me of Croatia circa 2006- Stifled creativity and a (over)reliance on wingbacks.
This is one of the main reasons why few sides play 3-5-2 anymore. While it can (possibly) work against 4-4-2, it's ridiculously vulnerable to most variations of 4-5-1. It also becomes too easy for a quality opponent to push the wingbacks back forcing the side to play a 5-3-2 instead of a 3-5-2. While it's not the only reason, this performance demonstrates that 3-5-2 is a poor choice of formation (or at least as a primary formation). With few exceptions, we didn't test their keeper- they looked like they had us under control for most of the match.
I've no problems with experimenting (I think it's good), but I just hope that Bilic sees that the same inherant weaknesses with 3-5-2( that caused Bilic to abandon it in 06) are still there.
The annoying thing though was that Kranjcar only got to go out wide for 10 mins when Krizanac got injured and we reshuffled and he scored, then Bilic took off modric for pranjic and Niko was back in centre. He needs to keep him out wide where he as space and he was showing incredible footwork just to keep possession in the centre. Left mid is Niko's best position, that's where i think he should play. Modric can cope in the centre. He'll be fine there. Rakitic is happy on the right. I actually think Bilic has the right combinations in his squad. Up front he has the hardworkers in Olic, Kalinic, Mandzo and Bilic, he has the finishers in Eduardo, Budan and Klasnic and he just needs to put it all together. I can think of plenty of coaches who have less to work with than Slaven Bilic. Dick Advocaat for one 🙂
I'm quite positive about things despite that i hoped for better style of play. There seems enough of a squad there to do good things.
All in all, I thought it was a really interesting game, it will give Bilic a lot to think about in preparation for the euro qualifiers.
Belgium played well by pressing the ball and stifling our midfield creativity, making it very difficult for us to create chances. Vukojevic was disappointing in DMF, a role that is so crucial for us with Modric in the centre. I wish Bilic had given Dujmovic more time on the pitch to see if he'd do any better. This is really so important for us to get right.
Cale seemed keen and played reasonably well, still has a lot to learn. Mandzukic was wasteful. Modric was having an off day, should really have put that chance away, on target at least!
Very happy with Kranjcar, his work rate has improved 10-fold and of course the goal. Runje does make me jumpy but didn't do anything wrong and put in some crucial saves.
My MOTM is without a doubt Corluka, who was as solid as a rock and put in some match-saving tackles.
Re: Ivo
I have no problem with that line up whatsoever. i'm not sure this 3-5-2 works. If he already had Cale at left i didn't see the need for him to go wing backs. Fair enough if Pranjic was there – then play wing backs, but Cale is an out and out defender so he may as well play 4-4-2. Not exactly sure what Bilic was doing today with his system. Someone needs to take Srna aside and ask him where he wants to play cos he seems to be going more and more defensive these days.
I'd play
Pletikosa – Srna, Corluka, Lovren or Krizanac, Simunic or Cale – Rakitic, Dujmovic, Modric, Kranjcar – Olic or Klasnic, Eduardo
Subs: M Bilic, Vukojevic, Pranjic, Knezevic, Petric, Badelj, Perisic, Runje
Reserve: Budan, Pokrivac, Juric, Gabric, Vida, Kalinic, Ilicevic, Mandzo, Lakic, Bartulovic, Schildenfeld, Subasic, Cesarec, Banovic, Tomecak
Yes i know Pletikosa is inactive, but Runje stills gives me butterflies
What about a line up like this:
Runje (Pletikosa)
Srna-Corluka-Lovren-Simunic
Modric-Dujmovic-Pranjic-Kranjcar
Eduardo – Olic
KLASNIC IN – MANDZO OUT – NEXT GAME
i'll also eat my hat on this occasion.. Runje did a bit better this time 🙂
Kranjcar goal
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62RRI0Ehpxc
looked like a good shot, but not great goalkeeping
Its fun how a win can paper over the cracks.. i think we were better defensively with rakitic, srna, kranjcar all working back. Mate Bilic and Olic working hard as well. We seemed to lack flow to our creative game and i think this had something to do with the formation whilst helping the defence messed up the midfield. Its obvious 4-4-2 is the best formation for the side going forward. Kranjcar finally got wide and scored a great goal. But he spent most of the game being stifled. Modric – reasonable, but not his best game.
On Cale. I thought he did very well defensively, but going forward he wasn't sure what to do. When Pranjic came on he looked better. If we are going to keep up this 3-5-2 its got to be Pranjic left wing back. Cale has shown he is reliable cover as a Lovren.
I thought the one player who had an excellant above average game was Corluka. Simunic did well too. Vukojevic had a bad first half, bit better second half, but was making bad passes as well.
Eduardo showed some nice stuff when he came on. 10 mins of Eduardo was more watchable than the 70 of Olic and Bilic. I think Klasnic has a place in this squad as well. Can't leave him out.
Why did Bilic wait to the last 10 to put on Dujmovic? I know that he's on season break but he could surely play for 30 minutes (btw I loved that one crunching challenge he put in…). Vukojevic simply doesn't have the personality that's needed in his position. Looking at others views of him on CSR, I'm clearly not the only one who thinks so.
I must say that the best thing to happen to Ivan Rakitic is Felix Magath- Ivan has become a MUCH different player recently. He (now) tackles, tracks back, and exudes a confidence (as opposed to a youthful arrogance) that he previously lacked.
Beautiful Niko.
Kranjcar, beautiful shot. Reminds me of the goal he scored against England at Wembley.
Approaching Hlf time, I'll say just 3 things (btw I missed first 9 minutes). Vukojevic has been lousy. There's too much space in front of the back line and Belgium have been dominating in that area. Hope to see Dujmovic replace him. Second, Bilic has put in a good shift- he's won more fouls than anyone(and he didn't have a chance on that cutback from Srna as their defender was sliding in as the ball reached him). Still, I'm not sure about him and Olic as a pair- I'd like to see Bilic-Eduardo. Third, Cale looks decent- way more comfortable than v Andorra. He's getting forward AND defending. Hopefully this continue.
First half – side looks rusty
Vukojevic giving ball away too much. Bring on Dujmovic.
Cale better defender than Pranjic but does not compare with him going forward. Bring on Pranjic.
Olic done his shift. Bring on Petric.
Srna yet to start playing some football. Too much talking and diving so far.
Modric, Krizanac, Corluka, Simunic playing alright 🙂 Rest of them need to play better.
Why the hell does Vukojevic still get the start? He has made little or no contribution…I was skeptical about Cale but I like his effort thus far.
The Ustream thing is not working for me. If anyone else is having the same problem try this one: http://www.roundplace.com/watch/13160/1/watch-belgium-vs-croatia-live-stream.html
with regards to the Hajduk game on the weekend. Strinic, Tomasov, Maloca and Sharbini all had excellent games. I don't know what that ceiling is for Maloca, he is steady, but don't know what the futute holds for him.
Strinic looked very good charging up and down from LB. I think he should be given another shot to earn at least one cap. Considering that nobody else has decided to take that job for themselves.
Sharbini and Tomasov looked pretty damn good. Marin Tomasov, from the last 5 games before the break, through the break and that opening game is looking better and better. He whips in a nice cross, has a very good shot from long range and is effective from dead ball situations. I would actually call for him to get a call up if he continues to play like he has been playing. Slaven Bilic was close to giving this kid a call when he was only 20 playing for Zadar. It took him awhile to steady himself at Hajduk, but hes looking pretty nice now.
Anas sharbini is also finally starting to find his feet. He had some great passes on the day. The pass to assist Cernat was reminiscent of something Xavi would do.
Nope, Maloca played on the weekend. Believe me, Maloca is very much first team. I watched the Hajduk game, they lined up Subasic – Rubil, Maloca, Buljat, Strinic – Skoko, Andric – Tomasov, Ibricic, Shrabini – Vukusic. Maloca always starts at CB.
I believe that Kramaric is definitely of the quality to be in the Under 21 team in some capacity. However, if he wont be starting, I don't want him on the bench. I think its critical for his development that he play as many competitive games as possible. Also, I dont think anyone can dispute this, his skill set is awfully similar to that of Kalinic. Kalinic is just much more physically stronger, knows how to hold the line and opposing defenses on his back in a 4-5-1. Personally, I do not like to similar strikers together. Thats just my opinion though. I am always in favor of lining up with 2 strikers, but, as I have also said, the strength of this team is the midfield. I believe that Ladic also recognizes that and has opted for ball possession tactic.
As for Tepuric, I have seen a few Slaven Belupo games, he has intrigued me. I do believe that Kramaric is a better forward. It all comes down to getting Kramaric the most minutes, for me anyways. In my view, if he cant start, then he has to play somewhere for a full 90 mins. The reasons I dont think he could start are as stated, in my view he and Kalinic are are bit of the same and we are playing to our strength which is the midfield area.
Jajalo and Badelj were also deployed in a holding role once again yesterday.
I still hope that Lovren and Vida will play the remaining three games. Lovren better see significant action in todays game.
Maybe Maloca won't start under new coach – wasn't it Pandza and Buljat at weekend. Seemed to do a pretty alright job.
There is room for Kramaric. Why can't Perisic shift to midfield on left. Badelj and Jajalo in centre with Oremus right.
Keleva, Vida, Barbaric, Maloca, Jozinovic; Oremus, Jajalo, Badelj, Perisic; Kalinic, Kramaric.
I can't see how there is no room for Kramaric. Also where is Duje Cop or Smrekar. How did Ladic draw the conclusion that Tepuric deserved a call up. i've already named about 8 players who could be ahead of him..
Maloca always starts for Hajduk when healthy and he isn't suspended.
Those other guys you mentioned, while they don't start for their club teams, don't expect them to start for the Under 21s. A seat on the bench is the right spot. As for Kramaric, I don't know if it is valuable for him. I think he should be playing as much as he can. Also, at 19, he has 2 cycles left with the Under 21s, plenty of time for young Kramaric. I think its the same as what Spain did with Bojan Krkic. The kid played as many games for all selections. He was literally bouncing up and down from the 17, 19 and 21s. Month after month, getting in as many games and helping all those teams. If Kalinic will be starting the games, I would rather Kramaric play a full 90 mins with the Under 19s then to have only 20 mins with the under 21s. The Under 19s will be entering phase 2 of their qualification this spring. He can definitely help them out there. He still has 2 campaigns ahead of him with the Under 21s as a prelude to a National Team call up. Kramaric and Vukusic would be a nice tandem for the Under 19s.
Got the squad in front of me now – Maloca does not always start for Hajduk. Vrsaljko – first game for Dinamo at weekend, Ozobic definitely does not start for Spartak Moscow and Tepuric also not a regular starter
Don't know where is – Jugovic, Knezevic, Milicevic, Kramaric, Vuckevic, Delic.. Those are the guys that play regular not Ozobic and Tepuric
Yeah it was Pamic wasn't it. Ademi is one of those round headed flat haired players as well so got him mixed up – with Jajalo and Badelj also coming from that type of hairstyle its not helping me seperate them from distance 🙂
Zvonko Pamic – i mean what are Rijeka doing there. The guy's on loan with Karlovac for what reason.
There was definitely space for Kramaric. This is another sign of Ladic's confusing selections. He selected FRANCIS TEPURIC – strange. Tepuric can't get in Belupo's team and done nothing so far. Kramaric is on the fringes of the Dinamo line up. Dodo prob played as we were playing rubbish Sesvete, but Kramaric could easily be a starter. He has to be playing for Croatia under 21's.
On Sertic – i don't actually believe he's had much of a season so far so first thing he needs to think about is getting regular club football. Same with Gavranovic if you're not playing then no point in thinking about international football at the moment.
I don't want the guy anyway. Unless you state from the beginning who your country is, then to hell with you. I don't want guys playing games and using two countries to wrestle against one another to get a guy a shot at the national team sooner. Anas and Ahmad Sharbini had other invitations as well, both stated that their dream is to play for Croatia. Sertic doesn't have the balls to say what he truly wants. He is basically plotting with his agent, trying to find a team where he has a realistic shot at playing regularly.
He should not play for Croatia under any circumstance. The kid can't read, write or speak croatian. That is reason enough not to include him. Plus, he is not croatian, he is french. His grandfather might have been a croat, but big deal.
I read that basically Sertic has long forgotten his roots and doesn't care to play for Hrvatska since he's 2nd generation French-or something like that.
That wasn't Ademi, he played the same day with the Under 19s. Zvonko Pamic took the free kick, his first under 21 cap by the way.
With Kalinic in the Under 21 program, not enough room for Kramaric, sad to say. Ladic seems to prefer a 4-5-1. The strength of this team is the midfield. Kalinic and Kramaric together could work, but, both strikers are a bit too similar in skill sets. If Kramaric was blazing fast, i could see it, but he is about the same speed as Nikola. Also, the fact that he doesnt start for his club team also works against him. These guys all start for their respective clubs. Ladic has emphasized how valuable starting for your club is to playing for the Under21s and success at that level on a personal level as well for the club. That being said, Kramaric should not be sitting on the bench. Starting for the under 19s is probably best. He still has plenty of time ahead with the Under21s.
I hope Lovren will be allowed to play the final 3 games for the Under 21s.
Vida's injured – Lovren is in the A side. I didn't catch the game, but that goal from Perisic was nice. I think Perisic will be a star in the A side. I think if you got Rakitic for the right and Pranjic for the left as cover – maybe we don't need Gabric. I think Perisic may provide more goals from midfield which is a problem. Rakitic scores, but Kranjcar and Modric don't quite score enough so perhaps Bilic needs to look at a goalscoring midfielder on his bench like Perisic rather than Gabric. I'm sure opportunities will still come for Badelj, Ilicevic and Gabric when people are injured, but i'd go with Perisic when the qualifiers start.
I don't mind this defeat much. The side isn't totally solid. The left is a bit iffy, Barbaric and Maloca aren't so great and if i'm right is that Ademi on that free kick.. these are only first matches for some of these players. Where was Kramaric?
where were Vida and Lovren?
That was a clear penalty. The First french goal was pure Class. You cant really blame anyone on that, it was executed to perfection. With no Vida and Lovren we were always going to have an uphill battle. There were still some positives to take away from that match for Ladic.
Clear Missed Penalty call….On a side note why don't you guys do a piece about up and coming croatian soccer prospects for the national team?
Who are the new up and coming faces to look out for, for the national team? Any stars on the horizon? What is going on with gregory sertic? Is he going to play for us?
That's a clear cut penalty in my book. I don't even know why there was an issue with no call. I guess it's a friendly for refs too. No big deal, just a scrimmage.
Thanks again for the vid Zach. You're always on top of things around here!
definetly looks like a penalty at 3:00
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e88Ib8YRpts&feature=sub
highlights
@ Ante
Doesn't bother me. I think everyone is thinking about tomorrow more than anything else.
Thanks for the updates guys. Anyone catcha video of the Perisic goal yet?
I didn't think putting up a post about a U21 friendly was necessary. Anyone disagree?
During the first half the match was pretty even (ended 1-1). I could even say that the referee didn't call a penalty over Kalinic by the end of that half. The second half, with a lot of subs in, was french without a doubt.
There's a big quality difference between the starters and the subs in the U21 national team. Definitely, Rakitic, Lovren and Vida have to be part of that team.
I watched pasts of the game and we played OK. France was the better side, but I would not put o much emphasis on a friendly.
Croatia U-21 were defeated 3-1 by France in friendly action today. Just reading reports now…Ivan Perisic with our only goal…