I also had to add something else. I can only assume you're from Dalmacija based on your last name and the fact you were at a game in Split. Go to neighboring towns like Sinj, Imotski and take a stroll up Krajina. Make sure to ask them the following: was the Domovinski Rat a civil war? Hopefully it would be greeted by a boot stomp to your face for being and idiot but I know I'm not that lucky. They'll just tell you that you're out of your mind. Hit up Skabrnja too and ask the same question.
Really, that's all you can come up with? Republicans? CNN?
Does life just suck for you? I remember when I was a virgin too, don't worry, it'll eventually happen. As for you commie roots which were confirmed by somebody in the GTA area, there's nothing I can do about that; you flaunt them more than anything in your answers.
Za Hrvatsku i Krista protiv komunista, do a little translation if you can…
The Young Republicans meeting end early today Ante? I am assuming you have Fox and Friends recording. Did you get the Sarah Palin 2012 bumper sticker yet!!
Well at least it's nice to see that you know your name dipshit, must be nice to answer to clown shoes or commie…but hey, it fits.
Do us a favor and kill yourself because you make Karl Marx blush with your commie propaganda. Go have fun with your serbian friends and make sure to remember that it wasn't a civil war as you watch Vukovar burn. Thank him and his people for that as well since we're all gentle snowflakes.
You're actually defending the Bosnians and Serbians. Wow, enough said.
Nosi se u tri picke materine, jebem ti majku komunisticku.
A)The intellectual community as was well as academic circles have been wrestling with questions such as the right/legalities to succession B)as well as the few Hundred Thousand Serbians/Bosnians that were driven from their homes and displaced during the opening period of war. Once they were displaced as well as once they entered the battle are also cases of civil war. I don't need your over simplified grade 5 definition of civil war (American v American). Civil war just as just war theory are topics that continue to be debated by the intellectual class. No concrete definition has been placed to either, they have been described a variety of ways.
I wouldn't expect you to understand any of those matters. As I said before, you are nothing more than a vulgar propagandist with delusions of grandeur. Ultra Nationalists like you are no different than the Millions of Turks who cheered when Hrant Dink was killed for writing about the Armenian Genocide, or the Millions of Jewish people who denounce Noam Chomsky and Norman Finkelstein as self hatting Jews for bringing Jewish war crimes to the forefront.
As I said earlier, you, like many more on this site have already shown that you are racists. That disqualifies you automatically from any Intellectual and rational debate. Just look at how you carry yourself, like a neanderthal high on methamphetamine.
"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds" – Albert Einstein.
I believe he ran into millions of AnteBBBs during his lifetime.
Hey clown shoes, we get that you're a commie but please let me know what is "nonsense ultra nationalist croatian historical grabage" about claiming that the Domovinski Rat from 1991-1995 was NOT a civil war, as your feeble mind belives it to be? Seriously, go have some drinks and drive home. There's no hope for you buddy.
@ Ziva Istina – Hmmm, I do think that some coaches can get to a point where the modern game can pass them by. If this was a conversation on tactics, then yes, I would take it with a grain of salt and do a bit more analysis. However, when it comes to analyzing a players attributes and projecting a future ceiling, or comparing his attributes with other notable players, then I would listen to him.
@ DinamoFan – Yes, at 19 this is his starting point. I totally agree with you in regards to the players on the payroll collecting dust. They will have to figure that out (The management that is). I have total faith in the work that was done over the winter break. Anas Sharbini, Marin Tomasov, Mario Ticinovic as well as Strinic have all been looking better and better. Ibricic is just solid all the time. I think 2nd place will be ours. I am hoping for some Croatian Cup success.
Well with Jonjic he has to start off in HNL1 – that's his starting point. Hajduk could arguably let go of Pandza to allow him to compete with Maloca and J Buljat. I still fear for Hajduk – still must remember they have Aracic, Vejic, Smoje, Pelaic, Seric, Buljat as defenders that they have no place for. Eventually theres got to be some come backs on having all these guys on long term contracts.
I was concerned with Ilicevic because I had read that he picked up a pretty serious injury during the winter break. Afterward, he started right off the bat, but has also been substituted in the 70 – 85 mins range for some matches, two games ago he didn't even start. He was back in the lineup in the Kaiserslautern win today though. Kaiserslautern will run away with a top 3 finish that will guarantee them a promotion spot. I am waiting to see how he does with stiffer competition. However, I can only assume that Kaiserslautern will also add to the squad as well. I would like to see him surrounded by some more weapons. It appears that its basically Illicevic and Sidney Sam that carry the work load at the moment. Lakic has chipped in for a few goals. I think Bilic would give him a shot, easily. He has already called him up twice the past year. Ilicevic just gets injured at the wrong time and always misses out.
As for Strinic, this was another good win for Hajduk. Reja was very confident during and after the winter preparations in Spain and on Brac. The midfield seems to have finally adapted to the use of the trident placed below the lone striker. Maloca must have picked up a slight pull midweek for the Under21s, I didnt even see him on the bench today. Little Mate Jonjic started alongside Buljat. Jonjic is a automatic starter for the Under 19s. He was just grabbed off Zadar. Someone that Tomislav Ivic is very high on.
Well i didn't see the game today, but it looks like Strinic is beneffitting and doing well. I think that Bilic could try Strinic before qualifiers starts if he wants to. Cale did okay, but he was a bit tentative with his passing. To be honest i would give the job to Simunic. He is confident on the ball and has played behind Kranjcar before so seems the sensible choice.
Ilicevic is in a disadvantageous position due to being in Bundesliga 2. I can't see him pushing ahead of Srna, Rakitic, Perisic and Gabric until he gets into the top flight. I just don't believe Bilic is that open minded. However with Under 21's involved in qualifiers maybe he could sneak in for next friendly.
Pray to God that Dujmovic does work, pray. If he doesn't work out, I cannot see anyone on the horizon that can handle that job by themselves at the moment. Pokrivac is working himself out of the squad. He isn't even featuring anymore in Austria. Ilicevic and Strinic deserve to be looked at, that's at the very least. I was stunned when he called Strinic up the first time. Since, I have been pretty impressed with his play. LB is wide open. At this point I wouldn't be afraid to give anyone a shot at auditioning at that position.
3-5-2 will never work, for anyone. In the modern game, teams collect so much video and prep for you so well. Most teams can pick apart a 3-5-2 easily.
i'm not concerned at all about Croatia after the Belgium game or bilic's comments. Bilic said he MAY try 3-5-2, but also said 4-4-2 is the best system for the team. We're mostly agreed the attacking play in 3-5-2 mostly didn't work as they couldn't combined centrally due to lack of space and when they did get out wide Cale wasn't that comfortable coming forward and Srna was having an off night.
But when they go back to 4-4-2 it'll be fine. Modric was a little edgy the other night, but will be back to his normal self in no time. Kranjcar fine on left mid and Pranjic is an outstanding guy to have as back up. Srna will be okay on the right wing and if not you've got Rakitic, Gabric that you can change him for.
The only thing that needs severe work is defensive mid. i'm not convinced Vukojevic is happy there. We've tested him and Juric now though. That's two who haven't nailed down the position. Try Dujmovic next, but if that don't work you have to ultimately work with the best of the lot.
Where the goals gonna come from that doesn't worry me at all. With the amount of strikers we have then you'd have thought we'd manage some against the opponents we have. To me the system had everything to do with the problems the other night as you've got to spread out to play a passing game. Can't be standing in each others space. Especially with an opponent like Verthoghen around and you stick Kranjcar in his space – that's just asking for trouble.
The team needs spreading out and it'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing Eduardo and Petric start next match. See if Petric has improved any since last matches.
Honestly, Boris, must everything be walked through at a snails pace with you?
Okay, yes, economy has little to do with football, so to do Intellectuals. So i cant understand why you chose that one point and are harping on that. You could have also used the fact that I said we produce enlightened Intellectuals. First, The 98 generation was produced well before the break up of Yugo. Most of those stars were formed and first recognized for their exploits in the junior tournament in Chile. So, yes my point does stand. The second point and the reference to the economy and Intellectuals was that, YES, time must be given. Just as I dont expect the enconomy to thrive, I dont expect the education system to flourish either. If you look at the original post, I said "what do you expect". Thats obvious sarcasm and you have dragged it along some tangent, for what purpose, I truly dont know.
Lastly, and we are know discussing this at nausea.
02/03 36.2 mins per game; .462 from the field; .763 from the line; 7.8 boards per game; 4.7 assists per game; 1.68 steals per game; 20.6 points per game. Okay, what from that do you see as being washed up? Obviusly not his best numbers when he and Stokton played together, still pretty damn good.
Payton 40.8 minutes per game in the 80 combined games he played that year; shot .454 from the field; .710 from the line; 4.2 boards; 8.3 assists; 1.7 steals and 20.4 points per game.
Those stats mean washed up to you? Then 98 percent of the league is washed up.
Ante, hurry up, you are missing Glen Beck. You can catch the rest of the Fox News later tomorrow. Dont worry, it will be the same old propaganda, you wont miss anything. Dude, honestly, do you have some steady diet of nonsense ultra nationalist croatian historical grabage with a side of CNN, FOX, ABC, NBC and CBS
wtf does a country's economy have to do with the quality of soccer? brazil and argentina were virtual banana republics for decades and have had plenty of NT success. italy is the laughing stock of EU economies, and they wont the last WC. Greece's economy is a complete joke and they won euro 2004.
the fact that the cro NT did it's best in 1998, so soon after the war, contradicts your premise that 'time must be given for any nation to emerge after such chaos'.
what "other variables" matter in determining NT success? the only variables that matter in the performance of the NT is the quality of the players and the quality of the manager.
no doubt he's a hall of famer, as is malone. but they didn't stop the lakers from getting smoked 4-1 by the pistons in the nba finals that year. and then the lakers didn't want either guy back the next year.
btw, the year before malone went to the lakers, he had his worst statistical year since his rookie year in 1985-86, and then he had career lows in stats in his only year with the lakers in 2003-04.
Chalk up another retard post of the month. Originality 0 Commie 1.
Dude, you think that Karl Marlone and Gary Payton were not wash-ups when they signed with the Lakers-they were.
You also seem to think that the domovinski rat (I know I have to translate this one for you: the Homeland War) that happened in Hrvatska (Croatia) was a civil war.
Really?
I'm not hiding behind anything. My name is Ante and the BBB is a play on my last name and the firm I love. Don't be mad at me because it can be proven without a shadow of a doubt that you're a commie just like your family.
As for the Goal, I am curious what the reactions would have been if it was the other way around. How many would have called for Runje or Pletikosa to be pulled if they allowed something similar? Thats just an exercise for you guys, put the shoe on the other foot. If it was a 3-0 scoreline. I wouldnt bring that goal up at all. For us to be the Belgian by that shot, thats a disgrace. Also, considering the fact that they pushed us around most of the game.
As for Malone/Payton. Honestly, you guys just dont follow Basketball, nothing more to say. They were washed up because the Lakers didnt win it now? thats it. Jesus Christ, guys are still logging 35+ minutes, 21 ppg and 8 boards and they are washed up. I guess Tim Duncan is washed up as well. Yeah, the Big Fundemental is no longer of use.
as for AnteBBB, dude, what to say about you, nothing really. You openning your mouth saves me the work. No wonder you have to hide behind a pseudonym, the way you carry yourself, who would want to hire someone when they behave like an animal on the Internet. Best to go hide in the crowd with the other BBB cowards as they only attack people when they out number them.
@ Boris – Hmmmm, The comment that our Economy is thriving was not a statement or trying to portray it as fact. Ziva Istina refrenced that the Nationa Team has done very little since 1998. I simply said, what do you expect so little after a civil war. Did he honestly expect that magazines like the Econmist would be raving about a thriving economy, and the comment about intellectuals was to show that neither of those two are possible after a civil war. I was trying to show that time must be given for any Nation to emerge after such chaos and that we cant take the last decade and a half and assume that the country has been on its own and thriving for centuries. Basically, other variables have to be looked at why the National team hasnt performed on an International stage.
Also, yes, I checked NBA.com for the stats. I checked the year right before he went to the Lakers. Thanks.
"am curious, do you follow geopolitics? After a civil war how easy is it to build a Nation? You do realize it takes some time? Did you think Periodicals like "The Economist" and "Prospect" would be doing expose after expose on how our economy is thriving and how we are producing such enlightened intellectuals? Can you name one Nation that didn't skip a beat after a civil war?"
the only thing more ridiculous than your repeated ignorant descriptions of the domovinski rat as a "civil war", is your assertion that the croatian economy is thriving. croatia has no viable economy on its own because its economy is managed by socialists and collectivists instead of the forces of free market enterprise. the only difference between the pre-war and post-war croatian economic system is that now they have multi-party elections to cloak their socialist agendas behind. the country is still run by commies. they just took off their commie hats after 1991 and established various so-called "democratic" political parties. look at the new president. his political party merely changed it's name from the communist party to the social democratic party. the croatian economy is a complete joke. you can't have a successful growing economy when the government constantly picks economic winners and losers based on political considerations. the croatian state completely controls major sectors of the economy (health care, education, energy, telecom and internet, agriculture, housing, etc.). the tax burden in croatia is enormous. croatia has a huge national debt. croatian citizens don't own their own labor. the public sector is bloated and corrupt. and try to get a business license in croatia. if you're not willing to pay bribes, forget about it. that's a recipe for economic disaster, as proven by the failure of EVERY other planned economy in history.
now you can't find a european collectivist's dick that the croatian government won't suck to get into the EU. we fought a war in the early 90's in order to break free from collectivist socialist masters in belgrade. so why would we trade that for collectivist socialist masters in brussels?
true political and economic freedom and liberty are what's needed for the croatian economy to prosper. until the croatian people have true political and economic freedom and liberty, the country will continue to slowly decline in economic terms.
not sure where you found your inflated stats for gary payton in the year before he went to the lakers. he got traded to the bucks from seattle right before the trade deadline that year, and was viewed mostly as a cancer in the bucks locker room. he was pissed about being traded away from seattle for ray allen, and didn't put much effort into the bucks playoff run that year because he didn't want to stay in Milw.
I've never heard anyone moan about a goal scored by one of our players before. that's just amusing. If you played the game you was definitely not a striker. any goal is good goal. The further out you are its harder to find accuracy. you do what you need to do to beat the opposition. that shot did the trick. is fair enough. well done niko. not a great display.. put just a friendly. moving on. The captaincy is not issue either. Regards Srna – the guy needs resting, so does Olic. Sometimes you don't find your A game and especially don't really need to in friendlies. If you can get a win fair enough. If Srna's display is that concerning drop him for Rakitic for a bit. Apart from that cant think of any other solutions. Whether he leaves Ukraine is down to a bid being put in which satisfies a very rich Shaktar Donetsk. If the bid aint good enough all those so called big sides can F off. Shaktar aint gonna hand over their player. If they don't pay then they don't guy. Its simple enough people.
of course they were washed up when they went to the lakers. if they weren't, the teams they were on would've re-signed them.
the lakers went downhill that year and didn't win the title. peyton and malone were one and done. gone the next year. that doesn't happen to guys in their prime.
you said "We barely beat the Belgians with an ugly Kranjcar goal. Yes, the goal was disgustingly ugly. It was hit with all pace, no accuracy."
no accuracy? it went into the back of the net, so how much more accurate could he get?
and it's pace left the belgian keeper looking for his jock in the back of the net. it was a bomb of a shot, and the winning goal. no need to minimize it.
You're an idiot if you think Malone and Payton WERE NOT washed up when they played for the Lakers; they completely were, especially Karl Malone.
You're a communist if you think there was a CIVIL WAR between Croatians and Serbians-they are two different nationalities. The Civil War in the States was American vs American.
Then again, I knew that clown-shoes over there was an idiot and communist; just made my point for me.
Ziva clearly gets the gold. The resident commie gets a DQ or OWNED.
lol Radman – i'll leave you to study how accurate or good Kranjcar's shot was. You talk about accurate – it hit the net – isn't that where it's supposed to go. I don't give a crap about whether there keeper saved it. I saw Cristano Ronaldo saw lots of goals like this for United that were hit with no great accuracy but just with power at the goal. Its a goal and its a friendly. That feeling of victory certainly papers over the cracks for me for this. Maybe i just don't have the time to think over the minor details you're dwelling over. Your taking the game way too seriously..
Hahaha, do we really have to argue about this now? Haha. If you did, I think it may have been down to a sneaky French judge that gave you the gold even thought I landed a quad.
Okay, two Croatians can take Gold and Silver at the Olympics if arguing was an Olympic event. We will agree to disagree and end this conversation. Otherwise we may lose all day to this. Its 7 degrees outside. I think you and I can both agree that for Toronto/Mississauga weather, far better things we can be doing right now than arguing with one another.
You mean the Lakers that already had Kobe and Shaq and only needed role players….yes, those Lakers. Malone and Payton were brought in as role players, nothing more and nothing less.
Again, my only point was that no players has ever taken less money in tehir prime. In the case of these two, they were not in their prime and did not take less money.
What great teams for God Sakes? i already told you, look at the clubs those guys played for when they were playing. Those guys started off on miserable teams. What were the red Wings when Yzerman came? what were the Nordiques? What was Roma when Cafu Played there, or when he played for Zaragoza. Those guys toiled in mid table mediocrity and were still considered great captains. Stop thinking of the Red wings and the Nords/Avs as the Stanley Cup Champs and look at them before those players made them great. Look at the teams Dunga played for, hardly world beaters.
You know what Ziva, you are so well connected. Hook up with Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith and tell them that both were washed up. I would like to watch TNT on a Thursday night and see Charles or Kenny nearly bitch slap you for that comment.
As I said, some things you say I agree with, here, you have no clue what you are talking about. It looks like you are only disagreeing to save face. Looks at the stats the year before they joined the Lakers in relation to their career highs and league average in relation to players at the same position. You have NO argument.
sinko……those were all great players and those teams would have been great with or without those players as captains, as long as they were on the roster. I can name you others who did nothing for their teams as captain and i can name players that were the leaders of their team and were not captain. I stick with my original response that the captaincy is highly overrated.
Dude, utter nonsense. So, one guys "claims" something so now its true? You sound like you would take the word of a drunk man at a bar rambling on how the Military Industrial Complex killed Kennedy just because someone said it to you. Yeah, asking a Canadian about Basketball is so far fetched. We invented the damn game. Dude, honestly, you dont have a clue what you are talking about when it comes to basketball. Malone and Payton were washed up, yet the Lakers, the LAKERS, used both in a gran scheme to bring in another title. Not players that would sit on the bench and be a veteran presence. Players that started and played starters minutes with Kobe and Shaq. Please Ziva, stop talking.
As for your sense of History. All those players I named played for such great clubs. For most of his 7 year Roma career, how well did Roma really do? Or while he was at Zaragoza? Sakic thrived and anyone who played with him thrived when he was playing on extremely poor Nordique teams. Dunga played for teams which were far from fashinable, what was the state of affairs for the Red Wings before and after Yzerman started lighting it up? He was one of the youngest captains ever and the first time he was given that honor he lead the red Wings to their first division title in 23 years. Please, you are out of your depth at times.
Again…….you still are wrong. he did not leave money on the table to join the Lakers. The only team that was going hard after him at that point was Portland and they offered him the same amount of money as the lakers. How do I know this??? just google the name of Aaron Goodwin. I know the guy and that info came from his mouth.
And Malone was well done at that point. he could barely walk at the end.
So, please show me other guys who have left money on the table in their prime. U can't.
Sometimes I think you disagree just to be different. We are talking about how they were before they joined the Lakers which would be the variable which dictates how much money they make on the open market. What in Gods name are you babbling about. He was putting up Plus numbers all across the board in relation to anyone in the league at that position. What the hell are you smoking buddy? Karl and He both took cuts to get there. Dude, stop talking, you are just embarrassing yourself now.
Payton was averaging nearly 39 mins a game, 21 points, 9 dimes, 1.5 steals and 3 boards the year before he joined the Lakers. Whats looks like its washed up there? How much do stats like that get you on the open market, that type of veteran presence and experience? Of those stats what makes you believe he was washed up?
obviously he wasn't putting up the same numbers he was when he played with Kemp, Detlef Schrempf and Nate Mcmillan. However, he was far from a player in decline, far from it.
You know what, don't challenge me on Basketball, please. I was born and raised in Canada and my first sport was Basketball, not Hockey, my team growing up was the SuperSonics. You comments are just foolish on the matter.
learn Basketball? Me? i think sometimes you just speak for the sake of speaking and dont know the subject.
Fluke = something that rarely happens. Croatia advancing to the 2nd round of a major tournament was something that had not happend since 98 WC, a span of 5 tourneys. So, yes it was a fluke. We did not qualify for the 2010 WC which evens proves my point that it was a fluke.
Yes I do follow follow geopolitics and yes i am aware of what the war did. But, you just showed me how much you know about geopolitics. It was not a civil war; serbs refer to it as a civil war/disturbance.
That is the reason I keep saying that by qualifying for these tourneys, that in itself is an accomplishemnt because we do not have the talent to win Euros and World Cups. We are good enough to qualify and that is it.
Bilic should be judged on how he does as a coach, not what he tells the press. We did not make the 2010 WC, so obviosly Bilic did not get the job done. I personally don't care if he tells the press Barca plays a 4-5-1. He treated the press like this when we qualified for the 08 Euros, so nothing has changed. What's the big deal in what he tells or does not tell the media. I has no impact on the sqaud and its performance.
The captain's armband is so overrated. All those guys you mentioned played on talented teams. Put them on a non-talented team and see what happens. Yes, leadership is important, but the value placed on the captaincy is way overrated. Boban was the captain, right??? But, was he the one talking to the players and being the leader in the locker room…nope. Ask anyone who was around that team and they will tell you there were two leaders on the squad. Stimac and Suker. Hell, Stimac basically ran the team back in the day. If you guys ever meet one of the players from the 98 WC team, ask them about some of the shit that went on behind the doors and the influence Suker and Stimac had on everyone. They were the leaders, but they did not wear the captain's band.
At Petar…….what are you smoking…Learn basketball my friend.
Payton did not leave any money on the table and he was on the downside of his career at that point. He was no where near the same player he was when Seattle went to the finals in the 90's. He was a huge liability on defense and defense was his calling card in his prime. My point is still valid, show me a player in their prime that took less money to play for a title contender.
And please do go look at the way Payton ended his career….he was washed up. The Miami years were riding the coattails of Wade.
As for your comments on our Euro 2008 as being a fluke. Are you serious? seriously? We have a very talented team. Nobody here would assume that the defense would show their age as quickly as they did, nobody truly understood how valuable Niko Kovac was to that team, or how steady Pletikosa really was. That is where you can see the drop in form, add to it the fact that coach is nuts. Yes, you are correct we did not play well since 98. I am curious, do you follow geopolitics? After a civil war how easy is it to build a Nation? You do realize it takes some time? Did you think Periodicals like "The Economist" and "Prospect" would be doing expose after expose on how our economy is thriving and how we are producing such enlightened intellectuals? Can you name one Nation that didn't skip a beat after a civil war?
Lastly, yes, Srna is allowed to live in Ukraine, play average football and get paid like a king, thats his choice. Hoever, he should also be held accountable for his actions. If he chooses to stay their too long and his game and skill set stagnates because he is not being challenged, then he will have to pay for that. Perhaps he should be as coddled as he is with the National Team. You guys did say it best, he is no superstar, however, he is being paid like one. Eventually, all superstars see their skills diminish as age ravages them. His salary, like others before him will eventually fall in accordance with that decline in form.
I wrote a well articulated, long response to everything debated above and the site never saved my comment. Hmmmmm, I will give it the short version now. After reading the article on the state of affairs of Belgian Football, I am curious how many people are outraged now? Lets open by saying that anyone, ANYONE who refers to games as "Just Friendlies" then you don't know jack about sports, stop watching, take up something like Golf. Teams like Spain, Germany and Brasil clearly show that much can be gained from games when 3 points isn't on the line. We should have buried those disorganized Belgians, sadly they pushed us around and took our lunch money as well.
With regards to our National Team Captain, or lack thereof. Dario Srna has been my FAVORITE player the past 10 years, hands down FAVORITE. The state of his play the past 2 years has been shocking for the Nation Team. I thought he would rise to challenge of being a captain, he has failed miserably at every opportunity. I cant recall one positive of him being Captain. That is how bad it has been. However, the play of Dario is simply a dot in relation to the whole picture. Aside from Vedran Corluka and Niko Kranjcar, nobody on this team has been steady. The coach, and then his on field general, the team Captain should be the calling influences and people the others look for guidance. Neither has given us any of those two qualities the past 1.5 years. The Captains arm band isn't some ceremonial artifact, it means something if wielded properly. Like honestly, if you think it means nothing then you don't follow sports. Sakic, Messier, Yzerman, Maldini, Cafu, Dunga, Xavi, Puyol, should I go on? Those are Captains, guys that may not be the most talented on their team at times, but they are the calming influence, they know how to motivate, they can take the coaches game plan and apply it on the field. Jesus, how many times when we were BLESSED with the presence of both Niko Kovac and Soldo did you see both of them, their arms spread wide, communicating, directing, verbalizing their instructions, keeping things tight at the back? Who does that now? Who freaken talks at all on this team? The opinion that Srna has not been acting like a captain isn't taken simply from the Belgium game, he simply hasn't done it well since it was given to him. I would seriously look at giving Corluka the arm band. he is soo steady, he is the one keeping things somewhat respectable at the back.
Also, this is at you Ziva Istina. If you think comments that Bilic makes are worthless, you couldn't be more wrong. This is our National Team coach. if he utters nonsense like a 3-5-2 can work, even though Niko Kovac and many others feel the tactic cannot thrive in the modern game, even though Bilic himself laughed at the formation when the English dared play us with the very formation, even though he is claiming teams like Barca play that way (when anyone who follows Barca knows he is F-ucking nuts because Alves, Puyol, pique and Abidal are the back 4); then he has to be held accountable for his remarksand they show how grossly out of touch he truly is. That should also provide a worrying sign of things to come for the National Team. We barely beat the Belgians with an ugly Kranjcar goal. Yes, the goal was disgustingly ugly. It was hit with all pace, no accuracy. if someone scored on Croatia like that, we would all be calling for that Goalies head, so lets not start declaring that to be considered an amazing shot.
Im sorry Ziva, if you think that they were washed up then you don't know anything about basketball. Also, YES, they did leave money on the table. Do you know how much they could have made on the open market? Give me a break. I agree with some things you say, not all. On this point you clearly are WAY OFF the mark.
The year before he joined the Lakers he averaged 37 mins on the court and hit 21 points per game, grabbed 8 boards per game and dished out 5 assists per game. Payton was averaging nearly 39 mins a game, 21 points, 9 dimes and 3 boards. Of those stats what makes you believe they were washed up? Just look at the minutes they were logging. Washed up? don't make me laugh. First ballot Hall of Famers rarely end their careers as washed up
at Petar….no, those two were washed up at that point in their careers. There has never been an NBA player who left money on the table in the prime of their careers to join a winning team. It just does not happen.
Srna won't take a paycut. He makes a nice living playing for Shakhtar and only a HANDFUL of teams would match it. With the recent spell of English teams in debt of up to 200M, you can rule out most English clubs paying for him.
That would leave either with Germany/France/Spain. Madrid is up to their eyeballs in debt, so only Barcelona would have the cash to pony up.
Actually you know what now i thought about this game more i thought good win. Also the so called big sides like Italy, Germany, France have been winning by playing crap for years. I don't see why Croatia shouldn't be allowed one or two scruffy wins. I'm sure the players will see it the same and draw confidence. They will also feel they can play better, but i do agree that guys like Olic and Srna may not have been relishing the matches. Both of them got bad tackles. The one on Srna was a nasty one. Olic was also kicked so much that you got to wander about the usefulness for all concerned of Olic playing friendlies. Maybe he should be allowed to conserve some energy in his later years and miss the odd friendly match. If Bilic wants to get the midfield combining and calling up Niko and Luka fair enough. He could omit Srna as well and give Gabric and Rakitic some time. He doesn't really need to make guys who play every week at club level like Olic and Srna play each friendly.
I guess though Eduardo should stay as he needs playing time. Petric has points to prove. Bilic too. Klasnic prob will still want to be involved considering he needs playing time at present. So actually it would only be Srna and Olic that should entitled too a little break.
Ziva, I agree with most of your comments except one; Are you telling me that Srna has a hard time getting excited playing a NT friendly but he's able to get excited playing on a potato field on the Ukrainian steppes (in Febuary) against teams like Metalurh and Voltva Poltava? I wouldve thought that Srna would be glad to be playing on a proper grass pitch on a temperate(ie, not-freezing) evening vs what he has to deal with in Ukraine. Other than that, I agree- it's only a friendly. So long as he doesn't try using 3-5-2 in a competitive match, I've no issues. Friendlies are the place to try things out- especially the crazy/stupid ideas.
I just saw the highlights for the whole match just now because the video didn't work last night. Shit, boys, the Vatreni played well and the score could have easily been 4-0. The passing was pretty crisp. They seemed a little nervous, that's why they didn't finish those gimme goals. Like I said before, the trainer needs to put a little Sljivovica in the water bottles to help calm their nerves. Belgium's closest call was the post hit.
I think Bilic is trying to shake things up. From this game I can tell they are a different, better team than the WC quals. The score is decieving. I didn't see any massive defensive fuck-ups like against England and Ukraine recently.
Perisic played for the U21 team, and looks like he will finish with them, at least until the U21 qualifiers are finished.
@Petar Radman
"Why was Dujmovic on the bench?"
I agree, however, maybe Bilic wanted to test Vuki since he just scored over the weekend and the Ukrainian league had just gotten underway. Dujmovic should be a little rusty playing the Russian league which is still on break.
Vuki has to be on the bench. The guy has gotten worse as the days go by.
Please send us the Guardian link on Belgium. First time hearing this.
@Ante BBB,
"DO NOT WRITE ANY MORE ARTICLES FOR THE LOVE OF ISUS"
hahahaha, we will see how the poll goes. ipak CSR je democracija
@Vinko Mustapic
Excellent take. Huge post of the week!
You stated the: 1)the problem(captain), 2)stated what doesnt work(Modric, Simunic, Srna) 3) solution (eduardo) 4) lastly, supported your take with facts and quotes…
brilliant I say, brilliant.
now that a few people have mentioned Eduardo, I am starting to open up my eyes to this idea.
@Boris
But do you think that Kranjcar hs the flair, the passion, the strength to be a leader?
Thanks for the link
@Ziva istina
"And then after mentioning we need passion, you suggest Kranjcar as the captain. Kranjcar is the one starter on the team that shows the least amount of passion or emotion. That is not a good or a bad element, its just his personality. I like the kid, but he is not captain material. He is quiet and shy, but very professional. Ask any of the guys on the team about Kranjcar and he is probably the last person they would suggest as captain. "
I agree 100%.
"he will leave Ukraine when another club is willing to match his wages. "
Then Srna will never leave Ukraine. No one will ever match his earnings at Ukraine. He is not worth that kind of $$$. Srna is a good player, just not a great player. However, he is getting great player $$$.
Players in the NBA take pay cuts so they can play for a better team and win a championship. Srna should take a paycut, so he can play in a top 4 league and prove himself as a great player.
greece is on the decline. they have no style, and will probably lose all three games in the group stage of the WC. losing 2-0 at home to senegal is a joke, friendly or not.
Boris….valid points on Srna. But, lets also be fair. He did the same shit when he was at hajduk in his early days, he did the same ditry shit when we were winning our games en route to Euro 2008. So, nothing has changed. I don't care who is captain.
Razor….You can have Modric as captain, and it would not be a bad choice, but to think younger players will look up to him is wishful thinking.
Petar…who cares what Bilic is telling the press. He can tell them we played great or we played lousy. It does not matter either way. Don't pay close attention to public comments made by Bilic, they are worthless.
I just don't see why such a big deal is being made over a friendly with Belgium. It did not matter what system we lined up in yesterday, it was the performace of the players, not the system. We could have played 4-4-2, 4-3-3 or anything else and the result would have been the same.
Did anyone see the nonsense Bilic was talking today. He claims that even Barca play a 3-5-2. This guys is nuts and is pissing me off now. Barca play a clear 4-3-3.
i didn't see the belgium game, and my view that srna shouldn't be captain anymore isn't based on this or any friendly. i've felt this way for a while. we didn't qualify for the WC….everyone has to deal with injuries, so that's not an excuse. on the field, it starts with the captain. srna takes dives, commits cheap fouls at times (as opposed to playing tough, physical but fair defense), and screams at the ref.
if olic remains a starter, then i'd go with him. but if he loses his starting job, then i'd go with niko. i like his silent but strong demeanor on the field. he doesn't bitch at the ref. he keeps his cool, which is something a lot of croatian players could learn from. maybe being named captain would bring the leader out in him.
obviously bilic is in the best position to know who the captain should be. in the end, thank god that the captain is chosen by the manager, and not by a poll on CSR 😉
as a proud croat, i love this site and the enthusiasm for cro soccer expressed here. but there is also some irrational homer-ism throughout the comments.
@ dinamofan
i agree…4-4-2.
this is how i hope it looks by the time we qualify for euro:
krizanac, corluka, lovren, cale rakitic, modric, dujmovic, kranjcar eduardo, bilic (maybe kalinic by then)
Theres only 1 way to go forward from here & that is appointing Luka Modric as Captain, The younger players need some 1 who they can look up to,some 1 who will give them guidance,& Modric is the Man at this point of time,Besides hes allready had stints as Captain 4 the Spurs be for the season began & Spurs Toured Asia..
Conclusion :
The Result is as i expected, Nothing much has changed since the team last got there assess kicked at Wembly, Same ole Non Motivated Football we have began to play..Wheres the damn Passion gone,I really FEAR not qualifieing for the Euro's if serious changes are not made..GREECE Would walk all over us at the moment & so would ISRAEL,At the rate & desire in which the team is playing the moment,MALTA would be a task..
BILIC either make some Serious Changes & experiment,Get things back on Track,Get that passion & desire back in the team,that wonerfull brand of football for which we have been known for,Or pack up your damnn Boots & get the hell out of here..Because at the moment we reak of stink & I cant stand to watch any more football at this level..
You lot need to stop making me agree with Ziva. I couldn't care less who captain is. Srna is annoying me at moment as he can't get off the floor, but that's about all. I know full well he's a better player than this, but he's just losing focus on his attacking game lately.
This squad is the quiet type. They all know each others game and that's how they engage i feel. I think they should be playing better than last night, but it was the formation. Spread out and then passing to each other might be easier. That's all they need telling after this game. 4-4-2 is the line up. The defence could be fine. Lovren, Corluka, Simunic, Krizanac, Knezevic, Cale is enough of a defence to qualify us. Then the Euro's end and Vida steps up. Problem yesterday was trying to make Cale into a wing back – that don't work.. and trying to make Niko play as roaming playmaker is stuff on the 1990's. Go 4-4-2 and its all fine. No big deal.
So let me get this correct…. some of you guys think Srna is not captain's material because of his lackluster play in a friendly against Belgium.
I know Srna's play since the EUROs has not been great, but please remember this was a friendly and dont draw too many conclusions from this.
I'll look at this from a player's perspective since I know a few of them and this has been mentioned to me a few times by some of the guys on the team. They hate these type of games (meaning the players who have been on the team for years). We are not going to the World Cup and Euro qualifying is still 6 motnhs away, there was no desire or passion to play this game. These guys play in best leages and the motivation is not there to play these games since we are not going to the WC. It was played in half empty stadium in cold weather against non-entity in the soccer world.
Forget about what happend at the 08 EUROS….that was a fluke and this team will never have an opportunity like that agin. Recall how we have played since the 98 World Cup. We are a squad that is good enough to qualify for the major tournament and that is it.
back to question of captain….Not an issue to me if it is Srna or whoever. But, in one seantace some of you guys claim we need someone with passion and someone who has to "talk" on the field. And then after mentioning we need passion, you suggest Kranjcar as the captain. Kranjcar is the one starter on the team that shows the least amount of passion or emotion. That is not a good or a bad element, its just his personality. I like the kid, but he is not captain material. He is quiet and shy, but very professional. Ask any of the guys on the team about Kranjcar and he is probably the last person they would suggest as captain.
Total nonsense about the talk. Everyone needs to commincate during a game, not just the captain.
yesterday's play was bad, no way of describing it any other way. But, its tough to play all out when their is no desire to play the game. These guys play in the biggest leagues in the world, so this type of game is a drop down in terms of level and committment. Maybe more younger guys should have played, but the u-21s had a game the day before.
One more thing on Srna….for those questioning His "easy lifestyle and desire to be famous", by the way total nonsense, he will leave Ukraine when another club is willing to match his wages. I don't know about you guys, but I sure don't know too many people that takes pay cuts in the prime of their lives. Take off the homer glasses and look at this stuff realistically.
@ Adrien – You couldn't be more wrong. I am at work now, when I get home I will send you a link to a article from the Guradian last spring. The Belgian side is in complete shambles. The players were all revolting, trying to be excused from games. The team Doctors were interviewed and all said that in their career, they never dealt with players like that in their lives. Players would come to the team doctors and ask to be given clearance not to play in National Team games because they were partying late the night before. There is a reason why Belgium is ranked where they are.
I really don't understand the overall negative comments I'm reading on the website.
Guys, this was a friendly against a well organised and very decent Belgian team. Their lack of success on the international level really betrays their capabilities as they have some excellent players (Vermaelen, Kompany) and a lot of up and coming talent (Witsel, Dufour, Lukaku/ 16 year old who has scored 14 times in 22 appearances for a top Belgian club). They're a young team that will be challenging the top teams around Europe in the years to come.
Admittedly we didn't play as well as we know we can but we still got a win and I think that in itself is something to be optimistic about. The basic ingredients of a world beating team are there, that much is certain and Bilic has the time to build it.
one more thing about kranjcar, that was a great goal. sure the keeper woulda/coulda/shoulda saved it, but the pace and knuckle-ball movement on his shot were fantastic. he showed how dangerous he can be running at the defense and shooting from distance. he forces other teams to account for him in those situations which can open up opportunities for others as well.
i agree with those that say that srna should no longer be captain. i'd go with kranjcar. other than maybe olic and simunic, he's probably got the most caps. olic isn't a lock in the starting lineup going forward, and simunic not only could lose his starting job but doesn't really have the right temperament to be a good captain. he makes a lot of dumb fouls and gets too many cards. niko is always calm and collected, and i don't think i've ever seen him throw anything that resembles a tantrum at the ref or on the field for any reason. and he's proven himself over and over again in the world's best league, the EPL.
I don't see Modric being Captain just not feeling it. That wide open shot he took on the pass from Srna was horrific I have no idea what the hell that was supposed to be or where it was targeted to go. I don't know if Simunic is the right choice for captain either usually he's all flared up but those anger management courses his clubmade him take changed him a bit too much. You need a captain with flare and dedication. Now I know people won't agree with this but how about Eduardo. He's captained Arsenala few times and in the occassion that he has he's showed up to the game netting some crazy beautiful goals. The dedication is there no doubt about it he says he enjoys playing the National Team more than the club and it's obvious why because his heart is in Croatia. Hell he was even hoping for the Under 21's to make the 2012 Olympics because they can take 3 senior squad players with them and he already and was the first player to declare himself to represent Croatia in the event that it happened because "I've always wanted to represent Croatia at a major event." Remember he didn't get called up for the 06' World Cup, that Enlgish garbage Martin Taylor *cough* *cough* SUCH A SETUP!Destroyed not just broke but DESTROYED his leg poor Eduardo got wrecked for NO REASON well I guess reason between the lines if you canread between them that is. I don't care if he's a naturlized Croatian or the fact that some people feel like he shouldn't because only a true Croatian should. To those people I say Eduardo represents himself as a TRUE Croatian and represents Croatia to the fullest and carries it with him more than people that are fully Croatian or of Croatian descent so I don't want to hear any garbage. He captained plenty at Dinamo as well and if you say well that's not enough experience for a Captain take this into consideration no one went through what he went through with the injury and still he maintained support all the wayfrom Rio De JAneiro for us when we played a Euro 08'. "After the game against Turkey I wanted break the T.V and everything." He knows he was the difference and he still is we're justwaiting on him to take full flight he's coming back slowly but he's coming and when he finally arrives it's going to be a spectacle to watch all over again.
Kaj je? Who was right, baby? How about that BUST Kranjcar? Dude, what I've told you before still holds true…even though he is a turncoat bastard putting on the toilet-paper color shirt…he is in no way a bust. My first example was Bulgaria in '06 followed by some other games…this is just added to the mix.
DO NOT WRITE ANY MORE ARTICLES FOR THE LOVE OF ISUS
Bilic hasn't learned anything over the past 2 years. We got lucky that the Belgian goalie is horrid, 90 percent of the goalies in the world stop that Kranjcar shot. It was hit with tons of venom, but sadly no accuracy. Why was Dujmovic on the bench?
Bilic is disappointing. His appearance as a guest panelist on a recent BBC soccer show had me questioning his ability to lead Cro to EURO 2012. He said Cro didn't qualify due to injuries, the ball hitting the post, etc. but he failed to mention that we lost 9-2 in two matches against England. What bothers me about todays line-up against Belgium is that he doesn't play guys that are in-form for their club teams. Why wouldn't you play Kalinic or was he even called up? How about Perisic? I agree with your comments on Vukojevic, he doesn't seem like the brightest player and is slow and makes many mistakes.
"Krizanac went off on a stretcher…I guess a higher power really wants Bilic to shake up the defense a little bit."
hahaha… hopefully, its not serious, as we are thin in defense.
I feel you on Dario Srna, hasnt been the same since Euro 2008. My vote was for Simunic to wear the captains band before Bilic decided to go with Srna. Now I dont think that Simunic would have been the answer.
Yes, I didnt like the 3-5-2 formation. I like 4 in the back.
no kiddin on the jerseys. Maybe the HNS said they are shit and returned them to NIKE…. Nike sucks.. have you seen the Netherlands jersey? I almost threw up.
@Slaven
"At least he tried a new formation. "
Well, I agree with you there. At least Bilic tried something new. If we go 3-5-2 we need 2 defensive minded midfielders. So in the end its the same shit. I do like our traditional 4-4-2
"All due respect to Srna but the only time I saw him fired up and yelling on the pitch was towards the flare tossers in Andorra."
haha, I agree… or when he is trying to get the referees attention after a missed call or tackle.
What a beautiful shot. I agree with nikarob and Denis 100%. Bilic needs to freshen things up like Capello did with England. He's very reluctant. At least he tried a new formation. Srna is not captain material and maybe Modric should be. I suggested Kranjcar before but either one of those guys are smart. All due respect to Srna but the only time I saw him fired up and yelling on the pitch was towards the flare tossers in Andorra.
Krizanac went off on a stretcher…I guess a higher power really wants Bilic to shake up the defense a little bit.
You can't take away anything from Eduardo. Regardless of how little he plays for Arsenal at the moment, he is a natural football player to make the tricky passes like he did today. He can just walk right into our lineup and be one of our top guys.
I can't take Srna anymore. What happened to the guy playing with all the passion in Euro 2008, the same guy that cried his eyes out when we lost to Turkey. In a year and a half, he seems to be a shadow of his former self, as a person and as a player. Initially, I thought he was a solid choice for captain, but now i am eating my words.
"Srna seems to be hardheaded and thinks he deserves lots of respect when he has really done nothing O.k "
I agree with you on this. There comes a time in life when people look to be recognized for their life achievements. Was he a great teacher, doctor, sports star, etc etc. Srna sold himself to Shakhtar, and wants to be recognized as a great footballer. As of right now, he will be a forgotten man in 10 years. You can expect to be recognized playing in Ukraine.
Srna is a celebrity in Ukraine and Croatia, and wants to be recognized around the world. The only way this will happen is if he shows up to play in top 4 football. Don't put on that Croatian shirt and captains armband and demand respect.
Ok, enough of me ranting. the way I see it is this:
1) Slaven Bilic didn't get anything out of this game. Same lineup, same players, same result.
2) same captain, same leadership, nothing changed.
3) Defense is in shambles.
4) Belgium outplayed us and deserved at least a draw.
5) Lastly, there hasn't been anything today that convinced me that Slaven Bilic has changed his tactics and isn't scared to experiment with new and young players. We have 2 friendlies in May to start fresh before the qualifiers start in September.
We need Modric simply to be captain , and talk and rally our boys Srna seems to be hardheaded and thinks he deserves lots of respect when he has really done nothing O.k granted he did score the goal against germany but not nearly enough Modric looks and seems humble and I think more of our boys would rally around him thank you, thank you very much.
I also had to add something else. I can only assume you're from Dalmacija based on your last name and the fact you were at a game in Split. Go to neighboring towns like Sinj, Imotski and take a stroll up Krajina. Make sure to ask them the following: was the Domovinski Rat a civil war? Hopefully it would be greeted by a boot stomp to your face for being and idiot but I know I'm not that lucky. They'll just tell you that you're out of your mind. Hit up Skabrnja too and ask the same question.
You and others like you disgust me.
Really, that's all you can come up with? Republicans? CNN?
Does life just suck for you? I remember when I was a virgin too, don't worry, it'll eventually happen. As for you commie roots which were confirmed by somebody in the GTA area, there's nothing I can do about that; you flaunt them more than anything in your answers.
Za Hrvatsku i Krista protiv komunista, do a little translation if you can…
The Young Republicans meeting end early today Ante? I am assuming you have Fox and Friends recording. Did you get the Sarah Palin 2012 bumper sticker yet!!
Well at least it's nice to see that you know your name dipshit, must be nice to answer to clown shoes or commie…but hey, it fits.
Do us a favor and kill yourself because you make Karl Marx blush with your commie propaganda. Go have fun with your serbian friends and make sure to remember that it wasn't a civil war as you watch Vukovar burn. Thank him and his people for that as well since we're all gentle snowflakes.
You're actually defending the Bosnians and Serbians. Wow, enough said.
Nosi se u tri picke materine, jebem ti majku komunisticku.
Ended.
Ahhh, had it right the first time, cant see anything on my BlackBerry.
My apologies, that was suppose to be secession.
A)The intellectual community as was well as academic circles have been wrestling with questions such as the right/legalities to succession B)as well as the few Hundred Thousand Serbians/Bosnians that were driven from their homes and displaced during the opening period of war. Once they were displaced as well as once they entered the battle are also cases of civil war. I don't need your over simplified grade 5 definition of civil war (American v American). Civil war just as just war theory are topics that continue to be debated by the intellectual class. No concrete definition has been placed to either, they have been described a variety of ways.
I wouldn't expect you to understand any of those matters. As I said before, you are nothing more than a vulgar propagandist with delusions of grandeur. Ultra Nationalists like you are no different than the Millions of Turks who cheered when Hrant Dink was killed for writing about the Armenian Genocide, or the Millions of Jewish people who denounce Noam Chomsky and Norman Finkelstein as self hatting Jews for bringing Jewish war crimes to the forefront.
As I said earlier, you, like many more on this site have already shown that you are racists. That disqualifies you automatically from any Intellectual and rational debate. Just look at how you carry yourself, like a neanderthal high on methamphetamine.
"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds" – Albert Einstein.
I believe he ran into millions of AnteBBBs during his lifetime.
No chance having a intellectual debate with someone that is an admitted racist. That excludes you right off the bat. Keep on hiding behind the BBB.
Hey clown shoes, we get that you're a commie but please let me know what is "nonsense ultra nationalist croatian historical grabage" about claiming that the Domovinski Rat from 1991-1995 was NOT a civil war, as your feeble mind belives it to be? Seriously, go have some drinks and drive home. There's no hope for you buddy.
@ Ziva Istina – Hmmm, I do think that some coaches can get to a point where the modern game can pass them by. If this was a conversation on tactics, then yes, I would take it with a grain of salt and do a bit more analysis. However, when it comes to analyzing a players attributes and projecting a future ceiling, or comparing his attributes with other notable players, then I would listen to him.
@ DinamoFan – Yes, at 19 this is his starting point. I totally agree with you in regards to the players on the payroll collecting dust. They will have to figure that out (The management that is). I have total faith in the work that was done over the winter break. Anas Sharbini, Marin Tomasov, Mario Ticinovic as well as Strinic have all been looking better and better. Ibricic is just solid all the time. I think 2nd place will be ours. I am hoping for some Croatian Cup success.
Well with Jonjic he has to start off in HNL1 – that's his starting point. Hajduk could arguably let go of Pandza to allow him to compete with Maloca and J Buljat. I still fear for Hajduk – still must remember they have Aracic, Vejic, Smoje, Pelaic, Seric, Buljat as defenders that they have no place for. Eventually theres got to be some come backs on having all these guys on long term contracts.
I wouldn't put too much into what Tomislav Ivic thins these days…. This is not the 1970's anymore….
I was concerned with Ilicevic because I had read that he picked up a pretty serious injury during the winter break. Afterward, he started right off the bat, but has also been substituted in the 70 – 85 mins range for some matches, two games ago he didn't even start. He was back in the lineup in the Kaiserslautern win today though. Kaiserslautern will run away with a top 3 finish that will guarantee them a promotion spot. I am waiting to see how he does with stiffer competition. However, I can only assume that Kaiserslautern will also add to the squad as well. I would like to see him surrounded by some more weapons. It appears that its basically Illicevic and Sidney Sam that carry the work load at the moment. Lakic has chipped in for a few goals. I think Bilic would give him a shot, easily. He has already called him up twice the past year. Ilicevic just gets injured at the wrong time and always misses out.
As for Strinic, this was another good win for Hajduk. Reja was very confident during and after the winter preparations in Spain and on Brac. The midfield seems to have finally adapted to the use of the trident placed below the lone striker. Maloca must have picked up a slight pull midweek for the Under21s, I didnt even see him on the bench today. Little Mate Jonjic started alongside Buljat. Jonjic is a automatic starter for the Under 19s. He was just grabbed off Zadar. Someone that Tomislav Ivic is very high on.
Well i didn't see the game today, but it looks like Strinic is beneffitting and doing well. I think that Bilic could try Strinic before qualifiers starts if he wants to. Cale did okay, but he was a bit tentative with his passing. To be honest i would give the job to Simunic. He is confident on the ball and has played behind Kranjcar before so seems the sensible choice.
Ilicevic is in a disadvantageous position due to being in Bundesliga 2. I can't see him pushing ahead of Srna, Rakitic, Perisic and Gabric until he gets into the top flight. I just don't believe Bilic is that open minded. However with Under 21's involved in qualifiers maybe he could sneak in for next friendly.
Pray to God that Dujmovic does work, pray. If he doesn't work out, I cannot see anyone on the horizon that can handle that job by themselves at the moment. Pokrivac is working himself out of the squad. He isn't even featuring anymore in Austria. Ilicevic and Strinic deserve to be looked at, that's at the very least. I was stunned when he called Strinic up the first time. Since, I have been pretty impressed with his play. LB is wide open. At this point I wouldn't be afraid to give anyone a shot at auditioning at that position.
3-5-2 will never work, for anyone. In the modern game, teams collect so much video and prep for you so well. Most teams can pick apart a 3-5-2 easily.
i'm not concerned at all about Croatia after the Belgium game or bilic's comments. Bilic said he MAY try 3-5-2, but also said 4-4-2 is the best system for the team. We're mostly agreed the attacking play in 3-5-2 mostly didn't work as they couldn't combined centrally due to lack of space and when they did get out wide Cale wasn't that comfortable coming forward and Srna was having an off night.
But when they go back to 4-4-2 it'll be fine. Modric was a little edgy the other night, but will be back to his normal self in no time. Kranjcar fine on left mid and Pranjic is an outstanding guy to have as back up. Srna will be okay on the right wing and if not you've got Rakitic, Gabric that you can change him for.
The only thing that needs severe work is defensive mid. i'm not convinced Vukojevic is happy there. We've tested him and Juric now though. That's two who haven't nailed down the position. Try Dujmovic next, but if that don't work you have to ultimately work with the best of the lot.
Where the goals gonna come from that doesn't worry me at all. With the amount of strikers we have then you'd have thought we'd manage some against the opponents we have. To me the system had everything to do with the problems the other night as you've got to spread out to play a passing game. Can't be standing in each others space. Especially with an opponent like Verthoghen around and you stick Kranjcar in his space – that's just asking for trouble.
The team needs spreading out and it'll be fine. I wouldn't mind seeing Eduardo and Petric start next match. See if Petric has improved any since last matches.
Olic should never start again for Croatia. Kranjcar lovely goal…where are we going to be getting our goals from in qualifying?
Honestly, Boris, must everything be walked through at a snails pace with you?
Okay, yes, economy has little to do with football, so to do Intellectuals. So i cant understand why you chose that one point and are harping on that. You could have also used the fact that I said we produce enlightened Intellectuals. First, The 98 generation was produced well before the break up of Yugo. Most of those stars were formed and first recognized for their exploits in the junior tournament in Chile. So, yes my point does stand. The second point and the reference to the economy and Intellectuals was that, YES, time must be given. Just as I dont expect the enconomy to thrive, I dont expect the education system to flourish either. If you look at the original post, I said "what do you expect". Thats obvious sarcasm and you have dragged it along some tangent, for what purpose, I truly dont know.
Lastly, and we are know discussing this at nausea.
02/03 36.2 mins per game; .462 from the field; .763 from the line; 7.8 boards per game; 4.7 assists per game; 1.68 steals per game; 20.6 points per game. Okay, what from that do you see as being washed up? Obviusly not his best numbers when he and Stokton played together, still pretty damn good.
Payton 40.8 minutes per game in the 80 combined games he played that year; shot .454 from the field; .710 from the line; 4.2 boards; 8.3 assists; 1.7 steals and 20.4 points per game.
Those stats mean washed up to you? Then 98 percent of the league is washed up.
Ante, hurry up, you are missing Glen Beck. You can catch the rest of the Fox News later tomorrow. Dont worry, it will be the same old propaganda, you wont miss anything. Dude, honestly, do you have some steady diet of nonsense ultra nationalist croatian historical grabage with a side of CNN, FOX, ABC, NBC and CBS
@ petar radman
wtf does a country's economy have to do with the quality of soccer? brazil and argentina were virtual banana republics for decades and have had plenty of NT success. italy is the laughing stock of EU economies, and they wont the last WC. Greece's economy is a complete joke and they won euro 2004.
the fact that the cro NT did it's best in 1998, so soon after the war, contradicts your premise that 'time must be given for any nation to emerge after such chaos'.
what "other variables" matter in determining NT success? the only variables that matter in the performance of the NT is the quality of the players and the quality of the manager.
@ petar radman
look closer at the stats. your claim that he averaged 21 pts, 9 assists, and 5 boards in the 02-03 season is a clear exaggeration.
http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=gary_payton
no doubt he's a hall of famer, as is malone. but they didn't stop the lakers from getting smoked 4-1 by the pistons in the nba finals that year. and then the lakers didn't want either guy back the next year.
btw, the year before malone went to the lakers, he had his worst statistical year since his rookie year in 1985-86, and then he had career lows in stats in his only year with the lakers in 2003-04.
http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=karl_malone
Chalk up another retard post of the month. Originality 0 Commie 1.
Dude, you think that Karl Marlone and Gary Payton were not wash-ups when they signed with the Lakers-they were.
You also seem to think that the domovinski rat (I know I have to translate this one for you: the Homeland War) that happened in Hrvatska (Croatia) was a civil war.
Really?
I'm not hiding behind anything. My name is Ante and the BBB is a play on my last name and the firm I love. Don't be mad at me because it can be proven without a shadow of a doubt that you're a commie just like your family.
Civil war, really?
Ended.
As for the Goal, I am curious what the reactions would have been if it was the other way around. How many would have called for Runje or Pletikosa to be pulled if they allowed something similar? Thats just an exercise for you guys, put the shoe on the other foot. If it was a 3-0 scoreline. I wouldnt bring that goal up at all. For us to be the Belgian by that shot, thats a disgrace. Also, considering the fact that they pushed us around most of the game.
As for Malone/Payton. Honestly, you guys just dont follow Basketball, nothing more to say. They were washed up because the Lakers didnt win it now? thats it. Jesus Christ, guys are still logging 35+ minutes, 21 ppg and 8 boards and they are washed up. I guess Tim Duncan is washed up as well. Yeah, the Big Fundemental is no longer of use.
as for AnteBBB, dude, what to say about you, nothing really. You openning your mouth saves me the work. No wonder you have to hide behind a pseudonym, the way you carry yourself, who would want to hire someone when they behave like an animal on the Internet. Best to go hide in the crowd with the other BBB cowards as they only attack people when they out number them.
@ Boris – Hmmmm, The comment that our Economy is thriving was not a statement or trying to portray it as fact. Ziva Istina refrenced that the Nationa Team has done very little since 1998. I simply said, what do you expect so little after a civil war. Did he honestly expect that magazines like the Econmist would be raving about a thriving economy, and the comment about intellectuals was to show that neither of those two are possible after a civil war. I was trying to show that time must be given for any Nation to emerge after such chaos and that we cant take the last decade and a half and assume that the country has been on its own and thriving for centuries. Basically, other variables have to be looked at why the National team hasnt performed on an International stage.
Also, yes, I checked NBA.com for the stats. I checked the year right before he went to the Lakers. Thanks.
@ petar radman
you said:
"am curious, do you follow geopolitics? After a civil war how easy is it to build a Nation? You do realize it takes some time? Did you think Periodicals like "The Economist" and "Prospect" would be doing expose after expose on how our economy is thriving and how we are producing such enlightened intellectuals? Can you name one Nation that didn't skip a beat after a civil war?"
the only thing more ridiculous than your repeated ignorant descriptions of the domovinski rat as a "civil war", is your assertion that the croatian economy is thriving. croatia has no viable economy on its own because its economy is managed by socialists and collectivists instead of the forces of free market enterprise. the only difference between the pre-war and post-war croatian economic system is that now they have multi-party elections to cloak their socialist agendas behind. the country is still run by commies. they just took off their commie hats after 1991 and established various so-called "democratic" political parties. look at the new president. his political party merely changed it's name from the communist party to the social democratic party. the croatian economy is a complete joke. you can't have a successful growing economy when the government constantly picks economic winners and losers based on political considerations. the croatian state completely controls major sectors of the economy (health care, education, energy, telecom and internet, agriculture, housing, etc.). the tax burden in croatia is enormous. croatia has a huge national debt. croatian citizens don't own their own labor. the public sector is bloated and corrupt. and try to get a business license in croatia. if you're not willing to pay bribes, forget about it. that's a recipe for economic disaster, as proven by the failure of EVERY other planned economy in history.
now you can't find a european collectivist's dick that the croatian government won't suck to get into the EU. we fought a war in the early 90's in order to break free from collectivist socialist masters in belgrade. so why would we trade that for collectivist socialist masters in brussels?
true political and economic freedom and liberty are what's needed for the croatian economy to prosper. until the croatian people have true political and economic freedom and liberty, the country will continue to slowly decline in economic terms.
Apologies for my typo's – i make so many i don't know where to beginning correcting myself 🙂
@ petar radman
not sure where you found your inflated stats for gary payton in the year before he went to the lakers. he got traded to the bucks from seattle right before the trade deadline that year, and was viewed mostly as a cancer in the bucks locker room. he was pissed about being traded away from seattle for ray allen, and didn't put much effort into the bucks playoff run that year because he didn't want to stay in Milw.
here are his career stats:
http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=gary_payton
I've never heard anyone moan about a goal scored by one of our players before. that's just amusing. If you played the game you was definitely not a striker. any goal is good goal. The further out you are its harder to find accuracy. you do what you need to do to beat the opposition. that shot did the trick. is fair enough. well done niko. not a great display.. put just a friendly. moving on. The captaincy is not issue either. Regards Srna – the guy needs resting, so does Olic. Sometimes you don't find your A game and especially don't really need to in friendlies. If you can get a win fair enough. If Srna's display is that concerning drop him for Rakitic for a bit. Apart from that cant think of any other solutions. Whether he leaves Ukraine is down to a bid being put in which satisfies a very rich Shaktar Donetsk. If the bid aint good enough all those so called big sides can F off. Shaktar aint gonna hand over their player. If they don't pay then they don't guy. Its simple enough people.
re: peyton and malone
of course they were washed up when they went to the lakers. if they weren't, the teams they were on would've re-signed them.
the lakers went downhill that year and didn't win the title. peyton and malone were one and done. gone the next year. that doesn't happen to guys in their prime.
@ petar radman
you said "We barely beat the Belgians with an ugly Kranjcar goal. Yes, the goal was disgustingly ugly. It was hit with all pace, no accuracy."
no accuracy? it went into the back of the net, so how much more accurate could he get?
and it's pace left the belgian keeper looking for his jock in the back of the net. it was a bomb of a shot, and the winning goal. no need to minimize it.
You're an idiot if you think Malone and Payton WERE NOT washed up when they played for the Lakers; they completely were, especially Karl Malone.
You're a communist if you think there was a CIVIL WAR between Croatians and Serbians-they are two different nationalities. The Civil War in the States was American vs American.
Then again, I knew that clown-shoes over there was an idiot and communist; just made my point for me.
Ziva clearly gets the gold. The resident commie gets a DQ or OWNED.
lol Radman – i'll leave you to study how accurate or good Kranjcar's shot was. You talk about accurate – it hit the net – isn't that where it's supposed to go. I don't give a crap about whether there keeper saved it. I saw Cristano Ronaldo saw lots of goals like this for United that were hit with no great accuracy but just with power at the goal. Its a goal and its a friendly. That feeling of victory certainly papers over the cracks for me for this. Maybe i just don't have the time to think over the minor details you're dwelling over. Your taking the game way too seriously..
so many comments, so little time.
I will be in San Francisco this weekend, returning sometime on Monday. Cant wait to be a part of this debate.
Thanks Ante and Ivica for covering for me, again 🙂
Hahaha, do we really have to argue about this now? Haha. If you did, I think it may have been down to a sneaky French judge that gave you the gold even thought I landed a quad.
agreed….and am glad you admit I won the gold
Okay, two Croatians can take Gold and Silver at the Olympics if arguing was an Olympic event. We will agree to disagree and end this conversation. Otherwise we may lose all day to this. Its 7 degrees outside. I think you and I can both agree that for Toronto/Mississauga weather, far better things we can be doing right now than arguing with one another.
Barkley and Kenny Smith…..they are entertaining, but Barkely offers nothing in terms of analysis
The "guy" is his agent.
You mean the Lakers that already had Kobe and Shaq and only needed role players….yes, those Lakers. Malone and Payton were brought in as role players, nothing more and nothing less.
Again, my only point was that no players has ever taken less money in tehir prime. In the case of these two, they were not in their prime and did not take less money.
What great teams for God Sakes? i already told you, look at the clubs those guys played for when they were playing. Those guys started off on miserable teams. What were the red Wings when Yzerman came? what were the Nordiques? What was Roma when Cafu Played there, or when he played for Zaragoza. Those guys toiled in mid table mediocrity and were still considered great captains. Stop thinking of the Red wings and the Nords/Avs as the Stanley Cup Champs and look at them before those players made them great. Look at the teams Dunga played for, hardly world beaters.
You know what Ziva, you are so well connected. Hook up with Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith and tell them that both were washed up. I would like to watch TNT on a Thursday night and see Charles or Kenny nearly bitch slap you for that comment.
As I said, some things you say I agree with, here, you have no clue what you are talking about. It looks like you are only disagreeing to save face. Looks at the stats the year before they joined the Lakers in relation to their career highs and league average in relation to players at the same position. You have NO argument.
sinko……those were all great players and those teams would have been great with or without those players as captains, as long as they were on the roster. I can name you others who did nothing for their teams as captain and i can name players that were the leaders of their team and were not captain. I stick with my original response that the captaincy is highly overrated.
Dude, utter nonsense. So, one guys "claims" something so now its true? You sound like you would take the word of a drunk man at a bar rambling on how the Military Industrial Complex killed Kennedy just because someone said it to you. Yeah, asking a Canadian about Basketball is so far fetched. We invented the damn game. Dude, honestly, you dont have a clue what you are talking about when it comes to basketball. Malone and Payton were washed up, yet the Lakers, the LAKERS, used both in a gran scheme to bring in another title. Not players that would sit on the bench and be a veteran presence. Players that started and played starters minutes with Kobe and Shaq. Please Ziva, stop talking.
As for your sense of History. All those players I named played for such great clubs. For most of his 7 year Roma career, how well did Roma really do? Or while he was at Zaragoza? Sakic thrived and anyone who played with him thrived when he was playing on extremely poor Nordique teams. Dunga played for teams which were far from fashinable, what was the state of affairs for the Red Wings before and after Yzerman started lighting it up? He was one of the youngest captains ever and the first time he was given that honor he lead the red Wings to their first division title in 23 years. Please, you are out of your depth at times.
by the way, asking a canadian to comment about basketball is like asking a norwegian to comment about cricket.
Again…….you still are wrong. he did not leave money on the table to join the Lakers. The only team that was going hard after him at that point was Portland and they offered him the same amount of money as the lakers. How do I know this??? just google the name of Aaron Goodwin. I know the guy and that info came from his mouth.
And Malone was well done at that point. he could barely walk at the end.
So, please show me other guys who have left money on the table in their prime. U can't.
Sometimes I think you disagree just to be different. We are talking about how they were before they joined the Lakers which would be the variable which dictates how much money they make on the open market. What in Gods name are you babbling about. He was putting up Plus numbers all across the board in relation to anyone in the league at that position. What the hell are you smoking buddy? Karl and He both took cuts to get there. Dude, stop talking, you are just embarrassing yourself now.
Payton was averaging nearly 39 mins a game, 21 points, 9 dimes, 1.5 steals and 3 boards the year before he joined the Lakers. Whats looks like its washed up there? How much do stats like that get you on the open market, that type of veteran presence and experience? Of those stats what makes you believe he was washed up?
obviously he wasn't putting up the same numbers he was when he played with Kemp, Detlef Schrempf and Nate Mcmillan. However, he was far from a player in decline, far from it.
You know what, don't challenge me on Basketball, please. I was born and raised in Canada and my first sport was Basketball, not Hockey, my team growing up was the SuperSonics. You comments are just foolish on the matter.
learn Basketball? Me? i think sometimes you just speak for the sake of speaking and dont know the subject.
Fluke = something that rarely happens. Croatia advancing to the 2nd round of a major tournament was something that had not happend since 98 WC, a span of 5 tourneys. So, yes it was a fluke. We did not qualify for the 2010 WC which evens proves my point that it was a fluke.
Yes I do follow follow geopolitics and yes i am aware of what the war did. But, you just showed me how much you know about geopolitics. It was not a civil war; serbs refer to it as a civil war/disturbance.
That is the reason I keep saying that by qualifying for these tourneys, that in itself is an accomplishemnt because we do not have the talent to win Euros and World Cups. We are good enough to qualify and that is it.
Bilic should be judged on how he does as a coach, not what he tells the press. We did not make the 2010 WC, so obviosly Bilic did not get the job done. I personally don't care if he tells the press Barca plays a 4-5-1. He treated the press like this when we qualified for the 08 Euros, so nothing has changed. What's the big deal in what he tells or does not tell the media. I has no impact on the sqaud and its performance.
The captain's armband is so overrated. All those guys you mentioned played on talented teams. Put them on a non-talented team and see what happens. Yes, leadership is important, but the value placed on the captaincy is way overrated. Boban was the captain, right??? But, was he the one talking to the players and being the leader in the locker room…nope. Ask anyone who was around that team and they will tell you there were two leaders on the squad. Stimac and Suker. Hell, Stimac basically ran the team back in the day. If you guys ever meet one of the players from the 98 WC team, ask them about some of the shit that went on behind the doors and the influence Suker and Stimac had on everyone. They were the leaders, but they did not wear the captain's band.
At Petar…….what are you smoking…Learn basketball my friend.
Payton did not leave any money on the table and he was on the downside of his career at that point. He was no where near the same player he was when Seattle went to the finals in the 90's. He was a huge liability on defense and defense was his calling card in his prime. My point is still valid, show me a player in their prime that took less money to play for a title contender.
And please do go look at the way Payton ended his career….he was washed up. The Miami years were riding the coattails of Wade.
As for your comments on our Euro 2008 as being a fluke. Are you serious? seriously? We have a very talented team. Nobody here would assume that the defense would show their age as quickly as they did, nobody truly understood how valuable Niko Kovac was to that team, or how steady Pletikosa really was. That is where you can see the drop in form, add to it the fact that coach is nuts. Yes, you are correct we did not play well since 98. I am curious, do you follow geopolitics? After a civil war how easy is it to build a Nation? You do realize it takes some time? Did you think Periodicals like "The Economist" and "Prospect" would be doing expose after expose on how our economy is thriving and how we are producing such enlightened intellectuals? Can you name one Nation that didn't skip a beat after a civil war?
Lastly, yes, Srna is allowed to live in Ukraine, play average football and get paid like a king, thats his choice. Hoever, he should also be held accountable for his actions. If he chooses to stay their too long and his game and skill set stagnates because he is not being challenged, then he will have to pay for that. Perhaps he should be as coddled as he is with the National Team. You guys did say it best, he is no superstar, however, he is being paid like one. Eventually, all superstars see their skills diminish as age ravages them. His salary, like others before him will eventually fall in accordance with that decline in form.
I wrote a well articulated, long response to everything debated above and the site never saved my comment. Hmmmmm, I will give it the short version now. After reading the article on the state of affairs of Belgian Football, I am curious how many people are outraged now? Lets open by saying that anyone, ANYONE who refers to games as "Just Friendlies" then you don't know jack about sports, stop watching, take up something like Golf. Teams like Spain, Germany and Brasil clearly show that much can be gained from games when 3 points isn't on the line. We should have buried those disorganized Belgians, sadly they pushed us around and took our lunch money as well.
With regards to our National Team Captain, or lack thereof. Dario Srna has been my FAVORITE player the past 10 years, hands down FAVORITE. The state of his play the past 2 years has been shocking for the Nation Team. I thought he would rise to challenge of being a captain, he has failed miserably at every opportunity. I cant recall one positive of him being Captain. That is how bad it has been. However, the play of Dario is simply a dot in relation to the whole picture. Aside from Vedran Corluka and Niko Kranjcar, nobody on this team has been steady. The coach, and then his on field general, the team Captain should be the calling influences and people the others look for guidance. Neither has given us any of those two qualities the past 1.5 years. The Captains arm band isn't some ceremonial artifact, it means something if wielded properly. Like honestly, if you think it means nothing then you don't follow sports. Sakic, Messier, Yzerman, Maldini, Cafu, Dunga, Xavi, Puyol, should I go on? Those are Captains, guys that may not be the most talented on their team at times, but they are the calming influence, they know how to motivate, they can take the coaches game plan and apply it on the field. Jesus, how many times when we were BLESSED with the presence of both Niko Kovac and Soldo did you see both of them, their arms spread wide, communicating, directing, verbalizing their instructions, keeping things tight at the back? Who does that now? Who freaken talks at all on this team? The opinion that Srna has not been acting like a captain isn't taken simply from the Belgium game, he simply hasn't done it well since it was given to him. I would seriously look at giving Corluka the arm band. he is soo steady, he is the one keeping things somewhat respectable at the back.
Also, this is at you Ziva Istina. If you think comments that Bilic makes are worthless, you couldn't be more wrong. This is our National Team coach. if he utters nonsense like a 3-5-2 can work, even though Niko Kovac and many others feel the tactic cannot thrive in the modern game, even though Bilic himself laughed at the formation when the English dared play us with the very formation, even though he is claiming teams like Barca play that way (when anyone who follows Barca knows he is F-ucking nuts because Alves, Puyol, pique and Abidal are the back 4); then he has to be held accountable for his remarksand they show how grossly out of touch he truly is. That should also provide a worrying sign of things to come for the National Team. We barely beat the Belgians with an ugly Kranjcar goal. Yes, the goal was disgustingly ugly. It was hit with all pace, no accuracy. if someone scored on Croatia like that, we would all be calling for that Goalies head, so lets not start declaring that to be considered an amazing shot.
@ Denis – http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/oct/07/belgium-world-cup-qualifying
Im sorry Ziva, if you think that they were washed up then you don't know anything about basketball. Also, YES, they did leave money on the table. Do you know how much they could have made on the open market? Give me a break. I agree with some things you say, not all. On this point you clearly are WAY OFF the mark.
The year before he joined the Lakers he averaged 37 mins on the court and hit 21 points per game, grabbed 8 boards per game and dished out 5 assists per game. Payton was averaging nearly 39 mins a game, 21 points, 9 dimes and 3 boards. Of those stats what makes you believe they were washed up? Just look at the minutes they were logging. Washed up? don't make me laugh. First ballot Hall of Famers rarely end their careers as washed up
at Petar….no, those two were washed up at that point in their careers. There has never been an NBA player who left money on the table in the prime of their careers to join a winning team. It just does not happen.
Didn't Garry Payton and Karl Malone take a pay cut to try and win with the Lakers?
Srna won't take a paycut. He makes a nice living playing for Shakhtar and only a HANDFUL of teams would match it. With the recent spell of English teams in debt of up to 200M, you can rule out most English clubs paying for him.
That would leave either with Germany/France/Spain. Madrid is up to their eyeballs in debt, so only Barcelona would have the cash to pony up.
Actually you know what now i thought about this game more i thought good win. Also the so called big sides like Italy, Germany, France have been winning by playing crap for years. I don't see why Croatia shouldn't be allowed one or two scruffy wins. I'm sure the players will see it the same and draw confidence. They will also feel they can play better, but i do agree that guys like Olic and Srna may not have been relishing the matches. Both of them got bad tackles. The one on Srna was a nasty one. Olic was also kicked so much that you got to wander about the usefulness for all concerned of Olic playing friendlies. Maybe he should be allowed to conserve some energy in his later years and miss the odd friendly match. If Bilic wants to get the midfield combining and calling up Niko and Luka fair enough. He could omit Srna as well and give Gabric and Rakitic some time. He doesn't really need to make guys who play every week at club level like Olic and Srna play each friendly.
I guess though Eduardo should stay as he needs playing time. Petric has points to prove. Bilic too. Klasnic prob will still want to be involved considering he needs playing time at present. So actually it would only be Srna and Olic that should entitled too a little break.
Ziva,
I agree with most of your comments except one; Are you telling me that Srna has a hard time getting excited playing a NT friendly but he's able to get excited playing on a potato field on the Ukrainian steppes (in Febuary) against teams like Metalurh and Voltva Poltava? I wouldve thought that Srna would be glad to be playing on a proper grass pitch on a temperate(ie, not-freezing) evening vs what he has to deal with in Ukraine.
Other than that, I agree- it's only a friendly. So long as he doesn't try using 3-5-2 in a competitive match, I've no issues. Friendlies are the place to try things out- especially the crazy/stupid ideas.
Denis,
I agree with everything you stated except the last point.
Who in the NBA – in the prime of their career – has taken a pay cut to play for a winner? I am unable to think of anyone.
I just saw the highlights for the whole match just now because the video didn't work last night. Shit, boys, the Vatreni played well and the score could have easily been 4-0. The passing was pretty crisp. They seemed a little nervous, that's why they didn't finish those gimme goals. Like I said before, the trainer needs to put a little Sljivovica in the water bottles to help calm their nerves. Belgium's closest call was the post hit.
I think Bilic is trying to shake things up. From this game I can tell they are a different, better team than the WC quals. The score is decieving. I didn't see any massive defensive fuck-ups like against England and Ukraine recently.
@T,
Perisic played for the U21 team, and looks like he will finish with them, at least until the U21 qualifiers are finished.
@Petar Radman
"Why was Dujmovic on the bench?"
I agree, however, maybe Bilic wanted to test Vuki since he just scored over the weekend and the Ukrainian league had just gotten underway. Dujmovic should be a little rusty playing the Russian league which is still on break.
Vuki has to be on the bench. The guy has gotten worse as the days go by.
Please send us the Guardian link on Belgium. First time hearing this.
@Ante BBB,
"DO NOT WRITE ANY MORE ARTICLES FOR THE LOVE OF ISUS"
hahahaha, we will see how the poll goes. ipak CSR je democracija
@Vinko Mustapic
Excellent take. Huge post of the week!
You stated the:
1)the problem(captain),
2)stated what doesnt work(Modric, Simunic, Srna)
3) solution (eduardo)
4) lastly, supported your take with facts and quotes…
brilliant I say, brilliant.
now that a few people have mentioned Eduardo, I am starting to open up my eyes to this idea.
@Boris
But do you think that Kranjcar hs the flair, the passion, the strength to be a leader?
Thanks for the link
@Ziva istina
"And then after mentioning we need passion, you suggest Kranjcar as the captain. Kranjcar is the one starter on the team that shows the least amount of passion or emotion. That is not a good or a bad element, its just his personality. I like the kid, but he is not captain material. He is quiet and shy, but very professional. Ask any of the guys on the team about Kranjcar and he is probably the last person they would suggest as captain. "
I agree 100%.
"he will leave Ukraine when another club is willing to match his wages. "
Then Srna will never leave Ukraine. No one will ever match his earnings at Ukraine. He is not worth that kind of $$$. Srna is a good player, just not a great player. However, he is getting great player $$$.
Players in the NBA take pay cuts so they can play for a better team and win a championship. Srna should take a paycut, so he can play in a top 4 league and prove himself as a great player.
@ razor
greece is on the decline. they have no style, and will probably lose all three games in the group stage of the WC. losing 2-0 at home to senegal is a joke, friendly or not.
Boris….valid points on Srna. But, lets also be fair. He did the same shit when he was at hajduk in his early days, he did the same ditry shit when we were winning our games en route to Euro 2008. So, nothing has changed. I don't care who is captain.
Razor….You can have Modric as captain, and it would not be a bad choice, but to think younger players will look up to him is wishful thinking.
Petar…who cares what Bilic is telling the press. He can tell them we played great or we played lousy. It does not matter either way. Don't pay close attention to public comments made by Bilic, they are worthless.
I just don't see why such a big deal is being made over a friendly with Belgium. It did not matter what system we lined up in yesterday, it was the performace of the players, not the system. We could have played 4-4-2, 4-3-3 or anything else and the result would have been the same.
Greece lol – oh yeah i'm seriously shaking. great defeat to Senegal i must say
Did anyone see the nonsense Bilic was talking today. He claims that even Barca play a 3-5-2. This guys is nuts and is pissing me off now. Barca play a clear 4-3-3.
btw, great picture from the fans at the game:
http://www.jutarnji.hr/slavlje-bilicevih–boysa–u-bruxellesu/605272/?foto=4
@ ziva
i didn't see the belgium game, and my view that srna shouldn't be captain anymore isn't based on this or any friendly. i've felt this way for a while. we didn't qualify for the WC….everyone has to deal with injuries, so that's not an excuse. on the field, it starts with the captain. srna takes dives, commits cheap fouls at times (as opposed to playing tough, physical but fair defense), and screams at the ref.
if olic remains a starter, then i'd go with him. but if he loses his starting job, then i'd go with niko. i like his silent but strong demeanor on the field. he doesn't bitch at the ref. he keeps his cool, which is something a lot of croatian players could learn from. maybe being named captain would bring the leader out in him.
obviously bilic is in the best position to know who the captain should be. in the end, thank god that the captain is chosen by the manager, and not by a poll on CSR 😉
as a proud croat, i love this site and the enthusiasm for cro soccer expressed here. but there is also some irrational homer-ism throughout the comments.
@ dinamofan
i agree…4-4-2.
this is how i hope it looks by the time we qualify for euro:
krizanac, corluka, lovren, cale
rakitic, modric, dujmovic, kranjcar
eduardo, bilic (maybe kalinic by then)
CAPTAIN !! ??????
Theres only 1 way to go forward from here & that is appointing Luka Modric as Captain, The younger players need some 1 who they can look up to,some 1 who will give them guidance,& Modric is the Man at this point of time,Besides hes allready had stints as Captain 4 the Spurs be for the season began & Spurs Toured Asia..
Conclusion :
The Result is as i expected, Nothing much has changed since the team last got there assess kicked at Wembly, Same ole Non Motivated Football we have began to play..Wheres the damn Passion gone,I really FEAR not qualifieing for the Euro's if serious changes are not made..GREECE Would walk all over us at the moment & so would ISRAEL,At the rate & desire in which the team is playing the moment,MALTA would be a task..
BILIC either make some Serious Changes & experiment,Get things back on Track,Get that passion & desire back in the team,that wonerfull brand of football for which we have been known for,Or pack up your damnn Boots & get the hell out of here..Because at the moment we reak of stink & I cant stand to watch any more football at this level..
You lot need to stop making me agree with Ziva. I couldn't care less who captain is. Srna is annoying me at moment as he can't get off the floor, but that's about all. I know full well he's a better player than this, but he's just losing focus on his attacking game lately.
This squad is the quiet type. They all know each others game and that's how they engage i feel. I think they should be playing better than last night, but it was the formation. Spread out and then passing to each other might be easier. That's all they need telling after this game. 4-4-2 is the line up. The defence could be fine. Lovren, Corluka, Simunic, Krizanac, Knezevic, Cale is enough of a defence to qualify us. Then the Euro's end and Vida steps up. Problem yesterday was trying to make Cale into a wing back – that don't work.. and trying to make Niko play as roaming playmaker is stuff on the 1990's. Go 4-4-2 and its all fine. No big deal.
So let me get this correct…. some of you guys think Srna is not captain's material because of his lackluster play in a friendly against Belgium.
I know Srna's play since the EUROs has not been great, but please remember this was a friendly and dont draw too many conclusions from this.
I'll look at this from a player's perspective since I know a few of them and this has been mentioned to me a few times by some of the guys on the team. They hate these type of games (meaning the players who have been on the team for years). We are not going to the World Cup and Euro qualifying is still 6 motnhs away, there was no desire or passion to play this game. These guys play in best leages and the motivation is not there to play these games since we are not going to the WC. It was played in half empty stadium in cold weather against non-entity in the soccer world.
Forget about what happend at the 08 EUROS….that was a fluke and this team will never have an opportunity like that agin. Recall how we have played since the 98 World Cup. We are a squad that is good enough to qualify for the major tournament and that is it.
back to question of captain….Not an issue to me if it is Srna or whoever. But, in one seantace some of you guys claim we need someone with passion and someone who has to "talk" on the field. And then after mentioning we need passion, you suggest Kranjcar as the captain. Kranjcar is the one starter on the team that shows the least amount of passion or emotion. That is not a good or a bad element, its just his personality. I like the kid, but he is not captain material. He is quiet and shy, but very professional. Ask any of the guys on the team about Kranjcar and he is probably the last person they would suggest as captain.
Total nonsense about the talk. Everyone needs to commincate during a game, not just the captain.
yesterday's play was bad, no way of describing it any other way. But, its tough to play all out when their is no desire to play the game. These guys play in the biggest leagues in the world, so this type of game is a drop down in terms of level and committment. Maybe more younger guys should have played, but the u-21s had a game the day before.
One more thing on Srna….for those questioning His "easy lifestyle and desire to be famous", by the way total nonsense, he will leave Ukraine when another club is willing to match his wages. I don't know about you guys, but I sure don't know too many people that takes pay cuts in the prime of their lives. Take off the homer glasses and look at this stuff realistically.
@ Adrien – You couldn't be more wrong. I am at work now, when I get home I will send you a link to a article from the Guradian last spring. The Belgian side is in complete shambles. The players were all revolting, trying to be excused from games. The team Doctors were interviewed and all said that in their career, they never dealt with players like that in their lives. Players would come to the team doctors and ask to be given clearance not to play in National Team games because they were partying late the night before. There is a reason why Belgium is ranked where they are.
I really don't understand the overall negative comments I'm reading on the website.
Guys, this was a friendly against a well organised and very decent Belgian team. Their lack of success on the international level really betrays their capabilities as they have some excellent players (Vermaelen, Kompany) and a lot of up and coming talent (Witsel, Dufour, Lukaku/ 16 year old who has scored 14 times in 22 appearances for a top Belgian club). They're a young team that will be challenging the top teams around Europe in the years to come.
Admittedly we didn't play as well as we know we can but we still got a win and I think that in itself is something to be optimistic about. The basic ingredients of a world beating team are there, that much is certain and Bilic has the time to build it.
one more thing about kranjcar, that was a great goal. sure the keeper woulda/coulda/shoulda saved it, but the pace and knuckle-ball movement on his shot were fantastic. he showed how dangerous he can be running at the defense and shooting from distance. he forces other teams to account for him in those situations which can open up opportunities for others as well.
re: NT captain
i agree with those that say that srna should no longer be captain. i'd go with kranjcar. other than maybe olic and simunic, he's probably got the most caps. olic isn't a lock in the starting lineup going forward, and simunic not only could lose his starting job but doesn't really have the right temperament to be a good captain. he makes a lot of dumb fouls and gets too many cards. niko is always calm and collected, and i don't think i've ever seen him throw anything that resembles a tantrum at the ref or on the field for any reason. and he's proven himself over and over again in the world's best league, the EPL.
I don't see Modric being Captain just not feeling it. That wide open shot he took on the pass from Srna was horrific I have no idea what the hell that was supposed to be or where it was targeted to go. I don't know if Simunic is the right choice for captain either usually he's all flared up but those anger management courses his clubmade him take changed him a bit too much. You need a captain with flare and dedication. Now I know people won't agree with this but how about Eduardo. He's captained Arsenala few times and in the occassion that he has he's showed up to the game netting some crazy beautiful goals. The dedication is there no doubt about it he says he enjoys playing the National Team more than the club and it's obvious why because his heart is in Croatia. Hell he was even hoping for the Under 21's to make the 2012 Olympics because they can take 3 senior squad players with them and he already and was the first player to declare himself to represent Croatia in the event that it happened because "I've always wanted to represent Croatia at a major event." Remember he didn't get called up for the 06' World Cup, that Enlgish garbage Martin Taylor *cough* *cough* SUCH A SETUP!Destroyed not just broke but DESTROYED his leg poor Eduardo got wrecked for NO REASON well I guess reason between the lines if you canread between them that is. I don't care if he's a naturlized Croatian or the fact that some people feel like he shouldn't because only a true Croatian should. To those people I say Eduardo represents himself as a TRUE Croatian and represents Croatia to the fullest and carries it with him more than people that are fully Croatian or of Croatian descent so I don't want to hear any garbage. He captained plenty at Dinamo as well and if you say well that's not enough experience for a Captain take this into consideration no one went through what he went through with the injury and still he maintained support all the wayfrom Rio De JAneiro for us when we played a Euro 08'. "After the game against Turkey I wanted break the T.V and everything." He knows he was the difference and he still is we're justwaiting on him to take full flight he's coming back slowly but he's coming and when he finally arrives it's going to be a spectacle to watch all over again.
Fistonicu aka HvarSplicanin,
Kaj je? Who was right, baby? How about that BUST Kranjcar? Dude, what I've told you before still holds true…even though he is a turncoat bastard putting on the toilet-paper color shirt…he is in no way a bust. My first example was Bulgaria in '06 followed by some other games…this is just added to the mix.
DO NOT WRITE ANY MORE ARTICLES FOR THE LOVE OF ISUS
cmok tebi i ostalima!
Bilic hasn't learned anything over the past 2 years. We got lucky that the Belgian goalie is horrid, 90 percent of the goalies in the world stop that Kranjcar shot. It was hit with tons of venom, but sadly no accuracy. Why was Dujmovic on the bench?
Bilic is disappointing. His appearance as a guest panelist on a recent BBC soccer show had me questioning his ability to lead Cro to EURO 2012. He said Cro didn't qualify due to injuries, the ball hitting the post, etc. but he failed to mention that we lost 9-2 in two matches against England. What bothers me about todays line-up against Belgium is that he doesn't play guys that are in-form for their club teams. Why wouldn't you play Kalinic or was he even called up? How about Perisic? I agree with your comments on Vukojevic, he doesn't seem like the brightest player and is slow and makes many mistakes.
@Ivica Peros
"Krizanac went off on a stretcher…I guess a higher power really wants Bilic to shake up the defense a little bit."
hahaha… hopefully, its not serious, as we are thin in defense.
I feel you on Dario Srna, hasnt been the same since Euro 2008. My vote was for Simunic to wear the captains band before Bilic decided to go with Srna. Now I dont think that Simunic would have been the answer.
Yes, I didnt like the 3-5-2 formation. I like 4 in the back.
no kiddin on the jerseys. Maybe the HNS said they are shit and returned them to NIKE…. Nike sucks.. have you seen the Netherlands jersey? I almost threw up.
@Slaven
"At least he tried a new formation. "
Well, I agree with you there. At least Bilic tried something new. If we go 3-5-2 we need 2 defensive minded midfielders. So in the end its the same shit. I do like our traditional 4-4-2
"All due respect to Srna but the only time I saw him fired up and yelling on the pitch was towards the flare tossers in Andorra."
haha, I agree… or when he is trying to get the referees attention after a missed call or tackle.
What a beautiful shot. I agree with nikarob and Denis 100%. Bilic needs to freshen things up like Capello did with England. He's very reluctant. At least he tried a new formation. Srna is not captain material and maybe Modric should be. I suggested Kranjcar before but either one of those guys are smart. All due respect to Srna but the only time I saw him fired up and yelling on the pitch was towards the flare tossers in Andorra.
…and where the hell were the new jerseys?
Nothing impressed me today. Absolutely nothing.
Krizanac went off on a stretcher…I guess a higher power really wants Bilic to shake up the defense a little bit.
You can't take away anything from Eduardo. Regardless of how little he plays for Arsenal at the moment, he is a natural football player to make the tricky passes like he did today. He can just walk right into our lineup and be one of our top guys.
I can't take Srna anymore. What happened to the guy playing with all the passion in Euro 2008, the same guy that cried his eyes out when we lost to Turkey. In a year and a half, he seems to be a shadow of his former self, as a person and as a player. Initially, I thought he was a solid choice for captain, but now i am eating my words.
I hope this is the end of the 3-5-2 for Bilic.
@Nikarob
"Srna seems to be hardheaded and thinks he deserves lots of respect when he has really done nothing O.k "
I agree with you on this. There comes a time in life when people look to be recognized for their life achievements. Was he a great teacher, doctor, sports star, etc etc. Srna sold himself to Shakhtar, and wants to be recognized as a great footballer. As of right now, he will be a forgotten man in 10 years. You can expect to be recognized playing in Ukraine.
Srna is a celebrity in Ukraine and Croatia, and wants to be recognized around the world. The only way this will happen is if he shows up to play in top 4 football. Don't put on that Croatian shirt and captains armband and demand respect.
Ok, enough of me ranting. the way I see it is this:
1) Slaven Bilic didn't get anything out of this game. Same lineup, same players, same result.
2) same captain, same leadership, nothing changed.
3) Defense is in shambles.
4) Belgium outplayed us and deserved at least a draw.
5) Lastly, there hasn't been anything today that convinced me that Slaven Bilic has changed his tactics and isn't scared to experiment with new and young players. We have 2 friendlies in May to start fresh before the qualifiers start in September.
We need Modric simply to be captain , and talk and rally our boys Srna seems to be hardheaded and thinks he deserves lots of respect when he has really done nothing O.k granted he did score the goal against germany but not nearly enough Modric looks and seems humble and I think more of our boys would rally around him thank you, thank you very much.
this performance made me sick to my stomach. We did not deserve this win. A 16 year old almost scored on us !!
thanks for the warning. my parents were sitting right next to me.
full highlights
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOzxCBTjWFg&feature=sub